Thomas McEvilley has done a systematic study of the correspondence between ancient Greek and Indian philosophy in his 2001 book The Shape of Ancient Thought. This post summarizes his discovery of the Kundalini concept in Greek and other ancient non-Indian cultures. The manner in which these concepts were divined or disseminated through various ancient cultures is a matter of contention, which I shall not pursue here.
The concept of Kundalini is well-known in ancient Indian scriptures and modern Yoga circles. There is supposed to be a subtle central channel named Sushumna alongside which run two auxiliary channels named Ida and Pingala. These two auxiliary channels are intertwined and criss-cross each other at five junctions which are called Chakras. The goal of Yoga is to practice Tapas (austerity) which conserves Retas and changes it to Ojas, (see the previous post on Transmutation of sexual energy for more) which eventually causes the Kundalini, a secret libidinal force which lies dormant at the base of the spine, to rise up through the Sushumna channel until it reaches the Sahasrara Chakra at the top of the brain. When this ascension of Kundalini occurs, the practitioner of Yoga is supposed to experience an incomparable ecstasy and when this power stabilizes in the head, it results in what is called Enlightenment or Self-realization, after which the soul is said to be freed from the cycle of reincarnation.
Greece
Thomas McEvilley cites Plato’s Timaeus which seems to discuss something similar to the Hindu doctrine of the Kundalini. In this book, Plato speaks of the divine seed which resides in the brain, which flows down the spinal column towards the sexual organs. He discusses two hidden channels which flow alongside the spinal column, which intertwine with each other at the throat and the heart knots(Chakras). Plato distinguished between two forms of Eros (Love). True Eros is the desire of the higher soul to be united with the World soul. When the soul becomes embodied in Matter and experiences the bewilderment of Time, True Eros or the desire for supreme knowledge is replaced by False Eros, which is sexual desire.
It may be beneficial to present some of the exact passages which McEvilley cites, so here they are as extracted from the translation by Benjamin Jowett. I used the translation available online here. There are other translations here and here.
In the first passage, Plato while discussing the formation of the human body mentions the soul-stuff (divine seed) that resides in the brain.
“That which, like a field, was to receive the divine seed, he made round every way, and called that portion of the marrow, brain, intending that, when an animal was perfected, the vessel containing this substance should be the head; but that which was intended to contain the remaining and mortal part of the soul”
[Plato. Timaeus, More about the body, 73c]
In this passage, Plato discusses of the two auxiliary channels (Ida and Pingala) which flow alongside the central Sushumna, as well as the the places where they intertwine.
“In the first place, they cut two hidden channels or veins down the back where the skin and the flesh join, which answered severally to the right and left side of the body. These they let down along the backbone, so as to have the marrow of generation between them, where it was most likely to flourish, and in order that the stream coming down from above might flow freely to the other parts, and equalise the irrigation. In the next place, they divided the veins about the head, and interlacing them, they sent them in opposite directions; those coming from the right side they sent to the left of the body, and those from the left they diverted towards the right,”
[Plato. Timaeus, More about the body, 77 d]
In this passage, Plato discusses the virtues of continence.
“He who has the seed about the spinal marrow too plentiful and overflowing, like a tree overladen with fruit, has many throes, and also obtains many pleasures in his desires and their offspring, and is for the most part of his life deranged, because his pleasures and pains are so very great; his soul is rendered foolish and disordered by his body; yet he is regarded not as one diseased, but as one who is voluntarily bad, which is a mistake. The truth is that the intemperance of love is a disease of the soul due chiefly to the moisture and fluidity which is produced in one of the elements by the loose consistency of the bones. And in general, all that which is termed the incontinence of pleasure and is deemed a reproach under the idea that the wicked voluntarily do wrong is not justly a matter for reproach.”
[Plato. Timaeus, Diseases and therapy of the soul, 86d]
Here, he discusses the manner in which the sexual organs are connected to the head through the vertebral column; the latter serves as a conduit for the “seed” which gives life.
“The outlet for drink by which liquids pass through the lung under the kidneys and into the bladder, which receives then by the pressure of the air emits them, was so fashioned by them as to penetrate also into the body of the marrow, which passes from the head along the neck and through the back, and which in the preceding discourse we have named the seed. And the seed having life, and becoming endowed with respiration, produces in that part in which it respires a lively desire of emission, and thus creates in us the love of procreation.”
[Plato. Timaeus, Genesis of Other Animals, 91b]
Knowledge of something akin to Kundalini seems to have been pervasive in ancient Greece, according to McEvilley. The Greeks referred to the spinal column as the Holy tube(hiera surinx). The Pythagorean and Orphic schools taught that semen comes from brain and is of one substance with the spinal marrow. Homer mentions that the cerebro-spinal fluid engkephalos was endowed with life-power. Alcmaeon of Croton stated that “holy tube” conducted engkephalos from the brain to the base of the spine, where it becomes semen. Diogenes of Appolonia, as quoted by Aristotle, is also said to have referred to the two auxiliary channels beside the spinal column:
‘The veins in man are as follows:- There are two veins pre-eminent in magnitude. These extend through the belly along the backbone, one to right, one to left; either one to the leg on its own side, and upwards to the head, past the collar bones, through the throat.” (Aristotle, Historia Animalium)
As McEvilley states in the book, the correspondence is noteworthy because anatomists cannot discover these occult concepts by dissecting cadavers; this knowledge can only be gained through occult insight or through exchange between cultures.
Egypt
While tracing the various possibilities of cultural dissemination, McEvilley cites the myth of Osiris in ancient Egypt. Osiris, the god of afterlife, is said to ascend to heaven over the spinal column of his mother, the goddess Nut, the vertebrae being used as the rungs of a ladder. This is similar to the Yogic concept of Enlightenment. Richard Onians in his book The Origins of European Thought suggests that the djed column, representing the spine of Osiris and worshipped as an “amulet of life,” indicates the same idea. According to Onians, the vital fluid in Egyptian iconography is repeatedly shown as being transmitted by laying the hand on the top of the spine or passing it down the spine.
Photo: Djed Column. (Via Flickr. Click image for source)
Mesopotamia/Sumeria
In analyzing the evidence across other ancient cultures, McEvilley also cites the Gudea vase which shows two serpents intertwined around a central axis, their bodies touching each other at seven knot-points. This is exactly how the Sushumna and its two auxiliary channels are arranged.
Gudea Vase. Click image for source
The symbol of caduceus seen below, a staff entwined by two serpents who intersect at five points, occurs in Greek mythology as well as in Mesopotamian sculptures. In Sumerian examples, the caduceus is depicted within the human body indicating a strong resemblance to the concept of Kundalini.
Integral Yoga of Sri Aurobindo & The Mother 
Thank you for this interesting post. I am curious as to why Desikachar [Heart of Yoga] states that ‘ha’ represents the moon and ‘tha’ the sun, and also his references to Yoga Yagnavalka and Yoga Rahasya, texts which take a different approach to kundalini [as an obstacle not an ascent]. Has anyone read these two books? Would like to know more.
I would also like to reading what the Mother and Sri Aurobindo had to say on kundalini. [I have read some of their comments, but would be great if you could provide posts or references]. Thanks.
> I am curious as to why Desikachar [Heart of Yoga] states that ‘ha’ represents the moon and ‘tha’ the sun
I have no idea regarding Desikachar’s interpretation.
> I would also like to reading what the Mother and Sri Aurobindo had to say on kundalini.
In Integral Yoga, the awakening of the Kundalini is not forced but should occur as a natural consequence of proper living. Secondly, descent through the head is preferred to the ascent from the bottom. See the Descent experience
See Letters on Yoga (SABCL, vol 22, p 73, Integral Yoga and other paths)
The Mother says she experienced the Kundalini awakening in Paris before coming to India (Agenda, July 11, 1970).
See
the chapter on Raja Yoga in the Synthesis of Yoga
CWMCE Q&A Vol 6, 24 March 1954
CWMCE Q&A Vol 7, 22 June 1955 (How can one awaken his Yogashakti? )
CWMCE Q&A Vol 7, 19 October 1955
See also Ascent Experience and Chakras
Thanks Sandeep, A very good article.
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thanks
Some links discussing contacts between ancient Greece and ancient India
Greeks in India before Alexander
Some other ancient Greeks in India
India and the Greek world by Jean Sedlar
How to raise the Kundalinini is secret science and lost from India 2600 years back. Lord Mahavira has done the secret Sadhana for 12 1/2 years X 365 Days X 24 Hours = 1,09500 Hours of Sadhana in standing position.
The Sidha and Arihanta level in Jainism represent this level which is given as open secret in Navkar Mantra pf Jainism.
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Wow, great post! As a meditator with current kundalini rising who loves Plato and Ancient Greece, albeit quite ignorantly as yet, I knew I had to read McEvilley but I don’t know how much I had to read him! The last time I read the Timaeus I must have been half asleep because I don’t remember the passages quoted.
Please do accept my thanks for your post here!
Jason,
McEvilley is definitely worth reading. He devotes a chapter to some peculiar parallels between the Greek Stoic school and Hinduism. Many of the Stoic scriptures were lost, but based on the extant manuscripts, it seems the Stoic averred the cyclic creation and destruction of the cosmos, the pneuma(i.e. conscious-force) which dwells in plants, animals and man, the interpenetration of the soul with the body, our existence after death, etc.
I plan to write a post on the Stoic-Hinduism parallels someday soon.
That would be great as I am a big fan of the Stoics and have read many of the texts — the more obscure early Stoics interest me most, esp. Chrysippus.
I just ordered McEvilley having already read the Plato/Kundalini ch. in the Amazon reader, to the extent possible, but it was a tease.
BTW the way I work has strong links with China also and there is huge kundalini evidence there, because all the traditions are still live. The lineage I work in was started by a martial artist called Glenn Morris whose way employs ch’i kung as well as standard yogic techniques. In China full kundalini was known as the ‘Greater Kan and Li’ (= Water and Fire) and there is a lovely set of techniques that dovetails well with others, now available since the Ch’i Kung Fever period of the 80s and 90s.
You might be interested in a recent blog post of mine on kundalini symbolism in Greek myth.
The only reason I never read McEvilley, as someone with a lot to read, was that he seemed too obsessed with trying to work out the geographical routes of cultural linkages. But having read that excerpt on Amazon he seems like a great scholar. I had no idea about that Pindar fragment for example.
> In China full kundalini was known as the ‘Greater Kan and Li’ (= Water and Fire)
Is there any authoritative book on this subject?
Sadly on this there is none that really pinpoints the cross-cultural stuff. The nearest is probably Kohn and Wang, 2009, which contains some degree of comparison of the two, plus Hermetics. It has much good stuff in it, although can be dense; it is very academically sound but also contains the voices of practitioners.
The connection was put together by Glenn long ago based to a great extent upon what actual Taoist energy practices did when combined with yoga approaches. The scholarship in this area is not yet cross-cultural enough to pick up some stuff though…
> Sadly on this there is none that really pinpoints the cross-cultural stuff.
In that case, feel free to recommend a good website as well.
I plan to check out the book anyways
Well a student of Glenn’s talks about it here, but only in practice terms. The proof being experiential.
Of course to get Glenn’s pov you can read his books — the first two being the most important — which are very well-researched but not fully cited in line.
The rest is down to actual practices, but those are not the same as the ones recommended by Aurobindo.
thanks, i will read it hopefully sooner than later
No problem, I hope you enjoy it!
I will be looking out for the Stoic stuff…
> I will be looking out for the Stoic stuff…
that will take time… i’ll notify you when i post it.
Thomas McEvilley’s talk on ‘The Shape of Ancient Thought’
Joseph Campbell noted kundalini references in ancient Egyptian, Roman, and Mesopotamian art in his lectures. Specifically Mythos II, EP4: The Way to Illumination.
thanks for the reference Eric. The episode can be bought from Amazon
Allusion to something akin to Kundalini by Plato may not seem strange given that Socrates once had a conversation with an Indian man, according to historical records:
According to the later testimony of Eusebius (260-340 A.D.) who got it from Aristoxenos (320-300 B.C.), Socrates conversed with an Indian holy man in Athens. The Indian asked Socrates what kind of a philosopher he was. When Socrates replied that he investigated human affairs, the Indian laughed and said: ” No one is able to observe human affairs if he is ignorant of divine affairs. (Eusebius, Evangelicae Praeparationis, XV.xi.3) as quoted in Zacharias Thundy, Buddha and Christ, Leiden ; New York : E.J. Brill, 1993, p 219)
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Recently I read Gopi Krishna’s experiences terrifying kundalini awakening experiences.It seems
that one should be under the special care of highly developed Guru when one is in the path of Yoga.May be that’s why SA calls it a battle, a real inner battle.I think the various spiritual practices are meant to develop the system so that it can withstand the Greater Force.
That is why the descending Kundalini (induced by concentrating on the Sahasrara) is preferable to the ascending Kundalini.
See https://auromere.wordpress.com/transformation/descent-experience/
But it seems that Gopi krishna was practicing some sort of meditation concentrating on head chakra in which case the Force should have descended instead of ascending.He states that the Force ascended through wrong channel and hence the turmoil.
You are indeed right. You seem to have done a lot of detailed reading in this field.
In chapter 1 of Kundalini the evolutionary energy (london, 1970), Gopi Krishna says he used to concentrate on the Sahasrara Chakra:
“Long practice had accustomed me to sit in the same posture for hours at a time without the least discomfort, and I sat breathing slowly and rhythmically, my attention drawn towards the crown of my head, contemplating an imaginary lotus in full bloom, radiating light.”
I guess it was to avoid such perils that Sri Aurobindo and the Mother prioritized the psychic transformation (opening of the heart Chakra) which would first create a condition of purity in the being.
In chapter 6, Gopi Krishna states that he wrote a letter to a renowned Guru asking for help:
“At last mustering my courage, I wrote to one of the best-known modern saints of India the author of many widely read books in English on Yoga, giving him full details of my extraordinary state and sought for guidance. I waited for his reply in trepidation, and when it failed to come for some days, I sent a telegram also. I was passing a very anxious time when the answer came. It said that there was no doubt that I had aroused Kundalini in the Tantric manner and that the only way for me to seek guidance was to find a Yogi who had himself conducted the Shakti successfully to the Seventh Centre in the head”
This Guru must have been Sri Aurobindo because we find a corresponding letter in the Letters on Yoga. Here it is:
“Sri Aurobindo cannot undertake to guide you as your Guru, for the reason that he takes as disciples only those who follow his special path of yoga; your experiences follow a different line. In his yoga there may be an occasional current in the spine as in other nerve channels or different parts of the body, but no awakening of the Kundalini in this particular and powerful fashion. There is only a quiet uprising of the consciousness from the lower centres to join the spiritual consciousness above and a descent of the Divine Force from above which does its own work in the mind and body – the manner and stages varying in each sadhak. A perfect confidence in the Divine Mother and a vigilance to repel all wrong suggestions and influences is the main law of this yoga. Your opening having once been so powerful on the more usual Tantric lines (even without your own will intervening), it is hardly probable that it could now change easily to other lines – any such effort might create a serious disturbance. In speaking of a competent Guru Sri Aurobindo meant one who had himself practised this opening of the centres and become siddha in that line of yoga. It should not be impossible to find one – when one has the call for the Guru, the Guru sooner or later comes. Meanwhile to put away fear and have confidence in the Divine working is indispensable – but no effort should be made to force the pace by concentrated meditation unless you have a guide whom you can trust – a clear guidance from within or a guide from without. The inspiration about the Ida nadi and the subsequent working of the Shakti show that there was an intervention at a critical moment and that the call to it whenever needed is likely to be effective.”
(Sri Aurobindo. Letters on Yoga, SABCL vol. 24, p 1148)
Gopi Krishna mentioned that he meditated on a the crown chakra, imagining a lotus in full bloom filled with effulgent light(I have read his books). In that case I think an Ascent experience is more likely, rather than a Descent experience. All traditional forms of yoga(which aim at Ascent-Kundalini jagaran) suggest developing an intense yearning/aspiration “upwards”. Satprem mentions this in his Adventure of Consciousness:
The difference in the direction of the current, ascending vs.
descending, has to do with a difference in goals which cannot be
overemphasized. Traditional yogas and, we suppose, Western
religious disciplines aim essentially at a liberation of consciousness:
the yearning of the whole being is directed upward, in an ascending
aspiration; the seeker strives to break through the appearances and to
found his station above, in peace or ecstasy. Hence the arousing of
the ascending Force.
——————————————————————————————————–
I think that SA’s integral yoga results in a Descent experience, not because concentration on crown chakra is advised(because that’s advised in traditional systems too), but because Silencing the mind as prerequisite is emphasized upon. That would lead to a state of receptive passivity of the being in which Divine force can descend, instead of the being focussed intensely on an Idea.
The ascent experience does take place in Sri Aurobindo’s Yoga as well.
He says so below:
“In our yoga” said Sri Aurobindo, “there is no willed opening of the chakras, they open of themselves by the descent of the Force. In the Tantric discipline they open from down upwards, the Muladhara first; in our yoga, they open from up downward. But the ascent of the force from the Muladhara does take place.”
I know that ascent does take place in SA’s yoga, I wasn’t opposing that. I have read quite a chunk of cwsa and am myself trying to follow this line of sadhana. What I was referring to was K’s comment about concentration on Sahasrar necessarily leading to descent experience: I opine that such practice is common to traditional lines of sadhana and is more likely to result in ascent than descent.
PS: I know it’s irrelevant, but if you don’t mind: how old are you ?
Arpan
Concentrating on the Crown Chakra breaks open the Golden lid. That is why it can lead to a Descent Experience. Ultimately, both ascents and descents together are required to enlarge the being.
See
Thanks for sharing the correspondence.
According to the Theosophists and others, Plato was a follower of Pythagoras.
Pythagoras had traveled to India, according to ancient records. The Pythagoreans had lots of Hindu knowledge in their mystic school
Maybe according to the Theosophists and other speculative authors. I don’t know if there is any evidence or authentic records of Pythagoras travelling to India, or Plato being a follower of Pythagoras. Even European scholars do not really know the exact dates of Pythagoras or his school. None of the direct records of Hellenic civilizations have survived into the present.
No, actually the recorded tales about Pythagoras traveling to India are ancient, didn’t come from modern speculative authors.
What modern speculative authors suggested is that maybe Plato was a follower of Pythagoras. Not in the sense of being a disciple, but in the sense of having been inspired by
The chines culture had an amazing amount of esoteric knowledge aka acupunture, tai chi, chi kung and l think kundalini yoga. Yet, Mother says , in general, the chinese don’t have a psychic being. Makes you wonder if the ancient chinese were a different species to the one’s we have in modern times!
Actually the story about Pythagorus in lndia is also supported by the well-known cypriot Mystic and Healer Daskalos [from the Spiritual point of view]:
“Daskalos usually met with some of his closest associates and
chatted casually on a potpourri of topics, from local politics to
the various techniques for journeying out of one’s body. When
I reached his home Daskalos was having lunch with Iacovos
and Kostas, another one of his closest associates, a forty-year-
old engineer. I found them in the midst of a discussion about
the Greeks of old. I politely declined their earnest invitation to
join their feast but merrily plunged into their debate. Daskalos
brooded on the over-zealousness of the ancient mystics in
guarding ‘the secrets.’
‘They should have tried to educate the people, particularly
the philosophers,’ he said forcefully, ‘rather than keeping the
knowledge egotistically to themselves.’
‘But Daskale, what about Plato?’ I pointed out. ‘As far as I
know he was involved with the Eleusinian mysteries. Much of
what you teach about the higher noetic world reminds me of
Plato’s world of ideas.’
‘There are some similarities but our teachings are not quite
the same. Incidentally, Plato was not involved with the
Eleusinian mysteries.’
‘That is what some authorities say,’ I noted.
‘They are wrong. Plato went to Egypt and became initiated
into the Egyptian mysteries. That is why he was called Plato.’
‘I don’t get that,’ I said. I had learned in school that he was
called by that name because he had a broad chest. The name
Blaton (Plato) allegedly was a derivative of a Greek word
meaning the ‘broad one’ or the ‘wide-shouldered one.’
‘That is historical nonsense,’ Daskalos scoffed. ‘His name
comes from Baal, meaning God, and Aton which in ancient
Egyptian meant “the Invisible God.” Baalaton was cut into
Blaton and in the English translation became Plato.’ Daskalos
then went on to make a similar case for another ancient sage,
Pythagoras. It was he, according to Daskalos, who introduced
the idea of reincarnation to the Greeks.
‘Pythagoras traveled to India and was introduced to Oriental
mysticism. He adopted his name from a Sanskrit word meaning
“he who has been initiated into the temple.” ‘
I commented that his interpretation of the names of these
ancient philosophers would probably raise the eyebrows of
many a scholar. Daskalos was not the least concerned. His
information, he said, was based on the ‘Akashic Records’ and
not on historical interpretations. He explained that the Akashic
Records is another word for Universal Memory. Whatever
exists, existed and will exist is imprinted in this pan-universal
supercomputer”
Just had a msg pop up when l tried to post:
“Your posting to fast. Slow down’ LOL.
“I know that ascent does take place in SA’s yoga, I wasn’t opposing that. I have read quite a chunk of cwsa and am myself trying to follow this line of sadhana. What I was referring to was K’s comment about concentration on Sahasrar necessarily leading to descent experience: I opine that such practice is common to traditional lines of sadhana and is more likely to result in ascent than descent.”
According to K [if this is the quote you mean] –
“But it seems that Gopi krishna was practicing some sort of meditation concentrating on head chakra in which case the Force should have descended instead of ascending.He states that the Force ascended through wrong channel and hence the turmoil”
l see arpan. As far as l know gopi krisna wasn’t meditating on a chakra as such, but on a pink lotus above the head somewhere [perhaps it’s the same, l’m not sure]. Yes, as you say, l believe SA said Himself, that concentration on a lotus above the head is like an ‘open invitation’ for kundalini to rise.
l’ve can’t remember SA advicing anyone in lntegral Yoga to meditate in the way gopi krishna did [on lotus at top of the head]. SA usually tells us to concentrate at the psychic centre and aspire from there. So, l’m not sure K is right when he says concentrating on sahasrar will bring down the Force/Shakti from above. lt seems to be a Tantric method that gopi krishna was using and apparently [as many are exeriencing today, it seems] the ascending Force went up the wrong nerve.
“PS: I know it’s irrelevant, but if you don’t mind: how old are you”
Sri Aurobindo told me in dream once:
“you might think your young, but your not”
Yes, that’s the comment I meant. I am quite sure K is wrong here (no offence meant), will be certain only after getting the experience myself. The whole “rationale”(such things are beyond “reason” though) behind focussing on head chakra is to concentrate all the energy and vision that on possesses on that point, when our surface consciousness and energy are totally focussed and we still dig deeper, the Total Energy of our being(Kundalini will be forced to forsake it’s slumber). While the rationale behind silencing the mind (beyond basic benefits like gaining a suitable manobhumi for any kind of sadhana) is gaining a calm receptive state in which the scient force “above” (the force below..is taken as non-sceint) to descend into the “empty” being.
PS: I asked about your age, coz I am generally curious about spiritual seekers, particularly young ones(in physical terms, for ur clarification, hehehe). Guess I am tired of encountering pseudo rational modern materialists-if u get what I mean-offline and online.
Btw, I never really understood what SA meant by old souls and new souls(psychic entities), is it just about the degree of development or that coupled with actual “time” they have existed for ? coz I always thought, that psychic beings are eternal.
Yeah, the beginning of the Descent of Force [and other things] probably requires Silence in the mind. SA started with this, as you you know.
ln my own case, the Descent started mysteriously without any knowledge of Yoga or Sri Aurobindo and the Mother, although l did start meditating one day – usually while lying down before sleep [l’m a bit on the lazy side lol]. Can’t say l felt ‘Empty’ at any particular time – it all just seemed spontaneous.
l had the vision of agni awakening and some strange experiences within my subtle body [like enlargement and my body feeling like a iron ball etc – preliminaries to the Force working on the adhar [is that the right word], l think. These days the Shakti comes and goes [l’ve still a long way to go lol]..
” Guess I am tired of encountering pseudo rational modern materialists-if u get what I mean-offline and online”
Yes, l know a few too, lol.
l also know what you mean about ‘old and new souls’. lt’s a little confusing at times.
SA and M sometimes talk about ‘young’ and ‘old’ souls but then you get SA saying this:
hxxp://auromere.wordpress.com/constitution-of-man/psychic-being/
“Purani: You have said that the psychic being is also a personality.
Sri Aurobindo: Yes, there is the psychic Purusha.
Purani: Does the psychic being develop from birth to birth?
Sri Aurobindo : It is not the psychic being itself that develops, but it guides the evolution of the individual being by increasing the psychic element in the nature of the individual. It is these personalities in nature that are bound.
Purani: Then it seems that the function of the psychic being is the same as that of Vedic Agni who is the God of Fire, who is the leader of the journey.
Sri Aurobindo : Yes. Agni is the God of the psychic and, among other things that it does, it also leads the upward journey.”
Well, I am not sure whether I have experienced a Descent or not, but during the time periods in which I am able to meditate the best I feel the following: a pressure(usually slight, but sometimes strong) around the back of my head and temples, and my ears feel like the way they do at rarefied mountain heights(ear canals feel as if they are closed). This pressure increases during “active meditations” and remains in the background throughout the rest of the day. (Any views ?)
I was always interested in meditation and spiritual stuff, but a strong turn towards this sadhana came after some experiences with those “materialists” embittered me: The way I saw them criticizing and ridiculing spirituality and India’s past, debunking one even if one gives uncounterable rationale, and yet claiming the High Seat in the realm of Rationality. A few suggestions of Vivekananda changed my approach towards these things:
“- Things of super sensuous nature are to be experienced, nothing is to be gained by vain talk.
– Study, argue, fight, but in the end, when a truth satisfies you, shut the world out and develop it withing yourself
-Every begger wants to make a gift of a million dollars.(hit me lol…I realized that how little I have experienced myself! Why would my words have the power to convince others!…winning debates was not my passion, except in early teenage, but establishing the Truth as truth was.)
-When you encounter a real jnani, the whole nature will rise to indicate it to you that he is the chosen one, anointed by the Mother herself to be a teacher of mankind, a very lion amongst men
-.Those who really want to be Yogis must give up, once for all, this nibbling at things. Take up one idea. Make that one idea your life — think of it, dream of it, live on that idea. Let the brain, muscles, nerves, every part of your body, be full of that idea, and just leave every other idea alone. This is the way to success, and this is the way great spiritual giants are produced. Others are mere talking machines”
And by SA or Mother(dont remember..am paraphrasing):
“When God wishes you to teach, He would give you the power of the Word. Then no power shall resist the truth within you.”(I avowed to speak only out of experience, and henceforth gave up argumentation)
————————————————
Another thing: Though SA suggests meditating on the Heart Centre usually(as that is in proximity to our true psychic centre), then why does he suggest keeping our consciousness concentrated on the Crown Centre during the day (as that is where the Shakti resides, according to Record of Yoga)?
“if man transfers his centre of heart and mind, to that of a higher
one, think how grand the God-man would be! That centre according
to the psychology of the Hindus is Vijnana. This is just above.
the crown of [the] head. This is known as Sahasradala or the place
where the Shakti is situated. From this seat of activity, all actions
emanate.
Therefore the first Sadhana is not to feel ourselves either in the heart or in the mind but there just above the crown of [the] head. By these two means, we separate ourselves from body, life and mind.
On account of this, misery cannot affect us and we will be above
happiness and misery. Apart from all these, the main thing we effect
thereby is, we will be in a position henceforward, to become one with
the Brahman and to realize that everything is Brahman and everything
is only one of the several forms, names and colours etc., of that one
Vast Brahman. Whenever we see people walking along the road, we
will no more see them as several different beings but as several forms
of one vast undivided Brahman. As [a] rose is the manifestation of
form, colour, odour so the Brahman is the manifestation of so many
things we perceive by the senses and think by the mind etc.”
– Record of Yoga (pg 1465-66)
Where is the true seat of our being : Crown of the Head or Heart Centre ? coz traditional yogas say that Shiv(our true being) is in Crown of the Head, and Shakti is situated in the Muladhar(sri aurobindo, though accepting the presence of Kundalini in Muladhar, whenever talks about shakti, he takes it to be in sahasrar). i can only gather (from SA’s Isha Upanishad), that what he means by “shakti in sahasrar” is the Chit Agni, the Will of the Ishvara, and by Kundalini, he means the total prana we possess. Any clarifications ?
Arpan, l believe the Shakti above the head might be called Adi Shakti, as in the diagram below [if it come out]:
Apparently, these are the signs of progress in meditation. But, when the Descent happens there will be no mistaking it, in my experience, especially the Descent of Peace. The Force will fill your body with an incredible Energy or Power. No doubt will be left.
“Indications of progress
If you meditate for an appreciable length of time and correct the following indications are possible:
Primary indications:
Increasing of the concentration power, clearness of concentration.
Overcoming of slackness and sleepiness.
Stopping of the thinking process.
Light pressure in the upper part of the head; afterwards sensation of Power in the whole body.
Sensation of dilution of the body.
Indications of further advancement:
Intellectual flow practically stops; ability for its control appears.
Sensation of pleasant coolness over head (activation of Sahasrara Chakra).
Inner physical sensations of space extension.
Possible sensations of inner sinuosity and swirling.
State of motiveless joy, easy and purity, both inner and physical.
Vision and physical sensations of the descending Light Energy and sensations of Joy in the whole Being.
Intuitive knowledge of any subject.
Recovery of disturbed functions.
Sensation of the present of God in everything.
Possibility of influence on current circumstances.”
In Isha Upanishad commentary SA does mention that Prana is the agent of Will in the lower creation(aprarardh) when he is describing the 7 levels of being (sat, chit, anand, vijnana, mind, vital, body) and their corresponding worlds(satya, tapah, jana, mahar, swar, bhuvah, bhur lokas). He says that Inconscient Prana is the counterpart of Chit Shakti(in Parardh: Higher creation) in Aparardh(lower creation). So I guess the descending force is the Conscious counterpart of the inconscient force of kundalini(both form 2 ends of a continuum. Btw, Kundalini does seem to act more and more intelligently as it ascends).
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The pressure I mentioned starts waning as soon as I indulge in any access or allow any not-so-noble thoughts, emotions to pass in me, even in the least. Yes, I feel less need for sleep, feel slightly less attached to various automatic preferences for comfort, taste(in food), more cool headed(I have a small patience problem), more alert etc. Yes, my concentration increases, but it’s a free concentration, as in, I donot get better at strenuous concentration(the reason I didn’t take up that kind of meditation), it’s a easy and relaxed concentration. Though Iam unable to maintain this state for more than 2 weeks- outer life pressures goble it up, but I do get to that state more quickly in the next zealous attempt.
the ability to localize consciousness at different centres of being and being aware of them is one of the initial discoveries says mother, probabaly we may extend this to the physical chakras as well, it’d be a sign of progress….. but to be doing these at will is definitely a challenge because you have to be one with the divine will always…..
K wrote above: Recently I read Gopi Krishna’s experiences terrifying kundalini awakening experiences.It seems that one should be under the special care of highly developed Guru when one is in the path of Yoga.May be that’s why SA calls it a battle, a real inner battle.I think the various spiritual practices are meant to develop the system so that it can withstand the Greater Force.”
The experiences of Gopi Krishna, unfortunately, have created quite a scare, but they are, however, mostly unique in exemplifying all that can go wrong in this “business” of raising the Kundalini. They were very personal, and very dangerous, but far from representative. These experiences, because of his books, created much baseless talk.
Come to think of it, we humans raise Kundalini Shakti every time we have an orgasm, day in day out, gladly, and rarely a person dies from it. Thus extrapolating what occurred to Gopi Krishna in relation to the practice of Kundalini Yoga is misleading, in the least. What happens is that there is lots of talk and little practice, mostly.
Yes, a Guru or Acharya is helpful. I practice Kundalini Yoga and raise the Kundalini Shakti daily several times, using forceful breath infusion of the Bhastrika type. Never had any problems and have been doing it for years. Anyone can do it.
Another think about the Kundalini I want to mention, I have found yoga practitioners and even some writing by Gurujis where it appears that the Kundalini, coiled in muladhara chakra is some force, there somehow, waiting for us “yogis” to awaken, use, play with.
It may be so that we can use it, awaken it and play with it, but it is in there previously and by itself. Kundalini = Life Force. Its pet project is reproduction of the species, period. Everything it does, is to support that. At nights it heals, fixes, the body. It explodes during orgasm. Why is there concentrated around muladhara and not around other chakras? Because that’s what we human are anchored to, the material manifestation, the earth, and that is where the power of sex is centered.
So that we know what we are against, when we dabble in yoga, Tantra, Kundalini Yoga if you like. For everything that the yogi will be doing, is basically “contra natura”, and the Kundalini, far from helping, will rebel and be a hindrance. Kundalini Yoga, Tantra, is the art of coaxing the Kundalini for spiritual enlightenment, little by little, through the agency of asanas, pranayam, mudras, bandhas, bhakti, and the art of removing the hormonal charge located around the muladhara and, more specifically, in the thighs. Without being able to do that, the yogi is toast. He/she thinks is doing some yoga, but nothing will happen in that front.
“The experiences of Gopi Krishna, unfortunately, have created quite a scare, but they are, however, mostly unique in exemplifying all that can go wrong in this “business” of raising the Kundalini. They were very personal, and very dangerous, but far from representative. These experiences, because of his books, created much baseless talk.”
Al, yes, l’ve read some of gopi’s books and f course that famous letter by SA [which l’m pretty sure was written to gopi krishna]. But, l’ not so sure it’s all that unique or rare from what l’ve read. These days it’s usually referred to as ‘Spiritual Emergency’ and indicates a premature awakening of the Kundalini and the problems arising because of impurities in the person – which would mean that the Force would not be able to ascend up the sushumna channel, but get diverted into the lda or pingala nadis and cause many problems [gopi krishna described this happening to him]. Also, it’s quite widespread around the world in different cultures, l believe.
As you say, the orgasm is a trivial experience of it [not the powerful experience that people usually describe], but it can manifest in many ways apparently:
“Kundalini can also awaken spontaneously, for no obvious reason or triggered by intense personal experiences such as accidents, near death experiences, childbirth, emotional trauma, extreme mental stress, and so on. Some sources attribute spontaneous awakenings to the “grace of God”, or possibly to spiritual practice in past lives”
As you say, dabbling in Yoga [not just yoga because many cultures have there own experience of kundalini] is a dangerous business and is literally ‘playing with fire’.
“A spontaneous awakening in one who is unprepared or without the assistance of a good teacher can result in an experience which has been termed as “Kundalini crisis”, “spiritual emergency” or “Kundalini syndrome”. The symptoms are said to resemble those of Kundalini awakening but are experienced as unpleasant, overwhelming or out of control. Unpleasant side effects are said to occur when the practitioner has not approached Kundalini with due respect and in a narrow egotistical manner. Kundalini has been described as a highly creative intelligence which dwarfs our own. Kundalini awakening therefore requires surrender; it is not an energy which can be manipulated by the ego”. So, it’s quite prevalent today
Anyway, this is the traditional tantric way l believe [from below-up] and is not used in SA’s Yoga – as you probably know. lt sounds like you might be following the Kundalini path of Sri Swami Sivananda or Shaktipat.
Nice to hear a response from you, Mike, I have come to admire your clear intelligence and knowledge after reading many of your entries, so thanks.
I have been trying to engage someone with several of my posts, given that these topics are so important to me, so I am glad to elicit a response.
Yes, I agree with those things you quoted, but drawing from my own limited experiences with the Kundalini is the reason why I find those descriptions a little overblown.
Please allow me disagree a little about orgasm being “a trivial experience”. On the contrary, I find orgasm to be akin to a nuclear explosion, and the best representation available to the layman of a Kundalini arousal.
Kundalini’s main purpose is digestion and repairing the body, so, as you said, its intelligence is mind boggling, you can put all the scientists together in the whole history of humankind and they will know a tiny fraction of what Kundalini knows. When I mentioned that its pet project is reproduction, I put the cart in front of the horse, but in reality this nutrition and maintenance go first, but are requirements for the reproduction itself.
Thus the yogi must content with Kundalini, respect it, and learn to use its awesome power little by little. At one point Atma Shuddha Yoga of purity is essential, as well as the Yoga of Celibacy, both are requirements to attempt the Urdhva Retas condition, a very, very difficult endeavor.
As per sushumna, ida, pingala…what are those? Am I joking? There is an entry by Sandeep somewhere here where he wrote something like this…”some people say there is a passage called sushumna along the spine”, and so on. I found that entry to be quite honest, for 99 % percent of people who talk about these nadis have never seen them or felt them, or perhaps they read about them in one of Arthur Avalon’s books.
You see, I do minimum 2 Kundalini yoga practices daily, using heavy breath infusion, to strike Kundalini in Muladhara with the breath and canalize it upwards using 4 locks, the anus lock, the belly lock, the throat lock, and the psychological pratyahar lock, and all this blindfolded to increase inner perception.
The book “Kundalini Yoga” by Swami Sivananda is a diluted book, it is for the neophyte yogi mostly. It goes all over the place.
The Kundalini Yoga I follow is unique, there are only a handful of people doing it in the whole world. It is also ancient as well, for some of the pranayama I do was followed by Arjuna while doing strenuous Tapasya in the Himalayas. Caution though, Hiranyakashipu and Ravana used it as well.
It is indeed of the bottom up classical type.
However, I also entertain, admire, closely follow, love, respect, study carefully, anything that Sri Aurobindo and/or the Mother Mirra Alfassa said or wrote, and use elements of their teachings in my sadhana, like “walking for the yoga”, aspiration, to propitiate a descend as well. As you well know, SA never disowned the classical Tantric, bottom-up approach, his uniqueness was to being in the complementary, top-down descend.
Al : I have been trying to engage someone with several of my posts, given that these topics are so important to me, so I am glad to elicit a response.
Sorry Al, I don’t have much time to respond on the blog these days but there are frequent blog readers who will respond within a few days. I just saw a response to you on another blog post.
Sorry l’m late replying Al, things to do.
l agree about celibacy. lt’s the most important condition, l think. l know from personal experience that the Force won’t have stability within the body without it – it becomes steady only through celibacy and the retention of retas.
l find that a lot claiming to practice the Spiritual Life don’t want to know about celibacy – could be wrong though. A lot are only interested in something called ‘sacred sexuality’ – a dangerous business if your not in the right state of consciousness IMO.
Yes, your right SA acknowledges both types of Kundalini awakening in His Yoga, albeit giving priority to the Descending Force. He does say that both take place in His Yoga – both Ascent and Descent of Kundalini. And in fact, they both mention that in the early days they both started with the traditional down-up experience – this was when M asked SA about the true number of chakras [12 apparently].
The clarification of the nadi system is confusing, and l certainly know very little about it. l find one of the clearest expositions in Dr Hiroshi Motoyama’s book ‘Theory of the Chakras’. He compares the nadi’s etc with the meridians in acupunture [a bit long]:
“The Nadis in the Physical Body
It has not yet been clearly determined just how many nadls exist. Some teachings speak of a total of 72,000 while others say there are as many as 340,000. Nevertheless, all available teachings cite ten or fourteen nadis as being more important than the rest. Of these, special importance is attached to the three major nadis – the Sushumna, the Ida, and the Pingala. Among the modern researchers engaged in physiological or anatomical studies of yoga, there are many who contend that the nadis are represented in the physical body by the nervous system. They theorize that the sushumna corresponds to the spinal cord and the ida and pingala to the sympathetic nerve trunks located on either side of the spinal cord. This inter- pretation sounds plausible at first, but a study of the ancient expositions of the nadis in the Upanishads and other yoga classics makes the theory difficult to accept. According to the Upanishads and other sources, the sushumna lies in the central canal of the spinal cord, and has an opening at the Gate of Brahman. Anatomically speaking, the central canal of the spinal cord contains no nerve fibers, only cerebro-spinal fluid. It is also neurologically impossible for the spinal cord to have an opening at the top of the head for the inflow and outflow of the prana. The governor vessel meridian, as known in acupuncture, shows clearer correspondence within the sushumna. The en- ergy flow in this meridian starts at the tip of the coccyx, as- cends the spine, reaches a point at the top of the head called hyakue (paihui, GV20), and then courses down along the me- dian line to a point just below the navel. The energy flowing in this meridian is said to be of the yang type and to control the whole body – which is what is said about the sushumna. Furthermore, in acupuncture theory, the Ki (Ch’i) energy of the cosmos is said to flow in and out through the hyakue point, which would seem to correspond to the Brahman gate. Thus, the sushumna shows a closer correspondence with the governor vessel meridian than with the spinal cord.
As for the ida and pingala, the ancient writings state that they start at either side of the Muladhara chakra (in the perineum) and terminate at either nostril. This clearly differs from the anatomical description of sympathetic nervous trunks, which do not start or end in these locations. On the other hand, the second lines of the urinary bladder meridian, which lie on either side of the spinal column, are known to course by the perineum and to terminate beside the root of the nose. To summarize the similarities between the teachings about the nadis of yoga and the meridians of Chinese medicine:
• They are both channels of vital energy, i.e., prana or Ki. • The courses of the energy flow in them bear a close mutual resemblance. • Many of the functions they perform are the same. (This will be discussed in detail in later chapters.)
The nadis of the physical body and the acupuncture meri- dians may therefore be considered essentially the same. How, then, did anyone – ancient or modern – come to discover the nadis and the meridians? First, the masters of acupuncture, moxibustion, and massage were able to discern intuitively the existence of meridians, or rather of energy flow, during treatment of patients. The color and con- dition of the body surface, changes of body temperature, etc., all probably served to give hints as to the existence of the energy flow. Second, both yogis and acupuncturists became aware of the internal energy flow through a kind of extrasensory perception during meditation. Much is written in the literature to substantiate this view, specifically in The Yellow Emperor’s Treatise on Internal Medicine (Huang Ti Nei Ching) and various sutras of yoga.”
“The Kundalini Yoga I follow is unique, there are only a handful of people doing it in the whole world. It is also ancient as well, for some of the pranayama I do was followed by Arjuna while doing strenuous Tapasya in the Himalayas. Caution though, Hiranyakashipu and Ravana used it as well.”
Al, l’m curious how you came across that Yoga Path. Did you find a Guru on your travels? ls it passed down through a line of Guru’s?
Your certainly working hard at it. l don’t think l could be so persevering 🙂
Hi this is unrelated to the current topic being discussed but could not find an answer elsewhere.
Q: How do we make sure we do not make the same mistakes in our next life? e.g. I might have made several mistakes in this life which have had painful consequences.
What do I need to do to make sure I don’t make those mistakes again ?
Or rather, how do I carry the “mundane” learnings of this life to the next?
I believe this is significant because even if you expose two kids to the same environment their response will be different and this I believe is due to prarabdha karma. e.g. refer the Stanford marshmallow experiment, or kids who beat the odds and succeed in life.
Would be grateful if anyone could answer this. Thanks
Sanjaya: How do we make sure we do not make the same mistakes in our next life?
There is no guarantee as such, but you have to make a daily effort to grow in wisdom and will-power through self-restraint and contemplation. As you develop Sattwic qualities, these will automatically carry over into the next incarnation. You might even develop contact with your inner guiding light, which will keep you away from any dangers lurking during the ignorant youthful years.
The qualities that you develop now will inhibit that destructive part which usually manifests in most young people.
Thank you Sandeep, for the reply and this wonderful blog. You make it easier to approach Their works.
The only way is to become more Conscious in this life.
Those habits and thought-forms [called elementals by some] follow us through many lives at the subconscious level, until the challenge is met and eradicated. The Psychic Union will do what’s necessary l believe. So, to aim for that is the solution…
Thanks Mike, that is helpful. Could you please give a reference for the thought-forms/elementals. Would love to read more.
Hi sanjay, yes it’s a fascinating subject. SA and M have said that the vital atmosphere
is swarming with these elementals or thought-forms. Of course groups like the theosophists have described them and might have actually coined the term – one of them, C W Leadbeater, l believe, even wrote a book on them and had a lot of pictures as well.
My main source, though, is the famous greek gnostic Daskalos [who had incredible powers from birth like M]. He was also clairvoyant from birth and he went into detail on this subject [of course, what he says needs to be balanced against what SA and M say about these things, but l find them in agreement in most cases] l’ve mentioned him before on the blog, but here is what he says about them:
‘Elementals
The subject of elementals cannot be exhausted. There was hardly a public Stoa Lesson by Daskalos that did not at least touch on the subject of the elementals. Daskalos considered the study of our elementals as one of the most important for not just his students but for all human beings.
Every thought, emotion and desire creates and transmits an elemental – also called thought-form – that carries on an existence of its own. We create and regenerate two types of elementals. When negative emotion prevails over thought, we have created emotional thought-forms, or desire-thoughts. When our ideas, desires and emotions pass through reason and love, we create reasoned thought-forms, or thought-desires. An elemental can never be destroyed, only disenergized (when no longer fed with etheric vitality). Elementals of a kind collect to form powerful group elementals. If an individual, or a collection of individuals, are vibrating at the same frequency, they will attract such group elementals. Archangels also create elementals (e.g. nature spirits and angels) in the service of the Divine Plan.
Researchers of Truth understand the triadic nature of their subconscious. One chamber of the subconscious contains all the elementals composing our personality. The second chamber is the storehouse of life-giving etheric vitality. The third, and most valued chamber, is that of the Logos and the Holy Spirit.
With appropriate training, we can project and direct etheric vitality from the etheric doubles of the bodies and send it over vast distances, and perform so-called miracles. To do this we can take part of the Mind-substance of etheric vitality, give it form and project it as a mental image, outside both our gross material body and our etheric double.
This happens consciously when we form what we call “thought-desires”, but unconsciously when we form “desire-thoughts”. Jesus Christ called the latter “deaf and dumb spirits” (Mark 9:25). These two types of thought forms, because they are both living forms, we call “elementals”.
Etheric vitality is the “Bread” which comes to us from Heaven. It is the means by which we build, when rendered into elementals, the present day personality. It is also the means of cleansing and purifying the character, which ultimately serves to assimilate our personality into the Inner Self–our Self-aware Soul.
We will concern ourselves with the way of using super-substance of Mind in the creation of psychonoetical images. Such images arise from the shaping of Mind into forms that we call “elementals”.
Our present personalities, that is to say the vehicle through which most of us experience and interpret the worlds, are compositions of various elementals born either subconsciously, self-consciously or super-consciously. Elementals having once been created and projected, gain a material existence of their own. Upon still closer examination, we learn that each elemental owns a psychic and a noetical counterpart, which inherits the intentions of its creator.
Life as we know it in gross matter is how we ourselves fashion Mind supersubstance coupled with the communal and global environments that have been pre-shaped around us.
In this way we create different conditions in and around us, which can approach the likeness of paradises or hells, or stand somewhere in between, which is what Catholics call purgatory. We each live in a shell, more or less permeable, of our own design.
Just as the gross material body consists of many cells, organized into a working whole, so our personality consists of a network of interdependent psycho-noetical images. The cells of our personality, as we might call them, are precisely, one by one, the elementals which we create and project as a result of our desires and weaknesses, strengths and virtues.
With every thought, each glance, idea, distraction or feeling we create elementals. Even as we sleep, we are emitting elementals that will affect us and those around us.
The elementals are emitted with an intensity corresponding to the strength of the desires which gave birth to them. When they have reached their goal and served their purpose, they return to their creator to be projected once again with ever increasing power. This procedure is repeated many times, creating within our personality, either a terrible environment of darkness if the elementals are of low degree, or a strong atmosphere of love if they are good thought-desires
In the same way we can poison the material body by consuming harmful food, or can cleanse it by improving the way we care for it, so we poison or cleanse our personalities. This is how human character evolves.
But what is character and what is its relationship with our personality? We have said that our material body is something which is in constant state of change. Substance enters it and other substance is discarded. Orthodox science tells us that with the passing of every seven years, not a single cell remains from the body of the seven years prior. We have the opportunity to shape our bodies and health in this constant process of renewal.
The same thing happens with our personality. Substance is taken in and substance is discarded. With the production and reproduction of elementals we build and rebuild our personality. Here, too, we create health or illness, contentment or dissatisfaction, and sow peace or unrest.
For most of us the construction of our personality is performed subconsciously, as we let desires and emotions dictate the character of the personality. Let us recognize the gift we have, to create and to form the holy supersubstance Mind, into heavens and hells. In a manner not unrelated to the Archangels, we have been given the authority and the responsibility to shape Mind into form. They shape the heavens without, we the heavens within.
We can identify various types of elementals. Some spring from inside the personality, others are drawn from the outside environment. We either create elementals with our desire-emotions and thought-emotions; or our personality vibrates at a frequency common to a collection of elementals of a like kind and then attracts these elementals. The latter are the so-called “group elementals” that have been cultivated over the centuries by the perpetuation of common beliefs and actions. They can be either benign or malicious in intent. Our personality, whether weak and ill-natured or strong and compassionate, will activate these group elementals. Once activated they will cling to the host personality, affecting emotions, thoughts and actions.
When such group elementals are particularly aggressive they can control our energy centers in a phenomenon similar to possession. Conversely, should they be benign and loving we might experience a sensation of great inspiration or even ecstasy.
The majority of the elementals we house are intelligent and demanding. They can force the personality to act in a certain manner which creates the conditions for the elemental to be satisfied and renewed. If we are filled with elementals of greed, envy and hatred, these elementals will dictate to our personality actions and behaviors that will lead to great disagreements and brawls, not to mention hellish inner dissatisfaction. If we are compassionate and peaceful in nature, our elementals will lead us into situations where we can be of some help and service.
Consequently, in spite of it being accepted that we do not have always full control over the condition of our material body, in the case of our personality the responsibility is ultimately exclusively our own.
If we have constructed a weak personality, we inevitably form centers of attraction which draw to us the corresponding elementals that others have created or are creating around us, which are hovering in the psycho-noetical atmosphere. But, even in this case, it is we who have the responsibility, because we attract and assimilate only those vibrations which resonate with ourselves. We cannot accuse other people, or the conditions which prevail around us, because the acceptance and assimilation of these elementals is purely our own choice and responsibility.
All around us there are human beings who live in ignorance and darkness, as well as others who make sensible use of Mind. There are, then, in our communal psycho-noetical environment good and bad elementals. There are angels – and demons too! It is for us to create the magnetic pole which will attract the one and repel the other. No demon can bother any human being who does not resonate with it.
On the other hand, someone who is laboring under a particular guilt, can temporarily be helped by an angelic being or through the meditation of other humans who pray for him, or by the expression of Divine Mercy. Prayer is the process of shaping and emitting loving elementals.
This help, however, is relative, for if the person in question has not matured psycho-noetically, the benefit derived will be temporarily. To be helped, the person must use this beneficial intervention as the starting point for right-thinking and development.
Let us not cast blame on our surroundings. There are many elementals around us. There are elementals, for example, of those we call alcoholics, many of whom try to present themselves as victims of society. Such people are responsible for their sorry state, since they have created or drawn to themselves very strong elementals, which take great will power to dis-energize. Yet the same elementals surround us all.
A common misperception prevails these days in popular psychology. Many psychotherapists believe that in order for a patient to recover he must relive certain emotions and events, venting memories and frustrations that have been plaguing the personality. In this process of “letting the steam out” more often then not the elementals surrounding a memory, rather then being weakened, are revitalized by the attention with which they are served. This method is counterproductive – except in a few cases – to the client’s recovery as it lends only more energy to the problems.
Elementals cannot be destroyed. Once an elemental has been created it will continue to exist in either an active state –when filled with etheric vitality from a personality– or in a dormant state –deprived of thought power, lying in the waiting in the Cosmic Consciousness–. Inasmuch as our personalities are composed both quantitatively and qualitatively of these elementals, in order to rid ourselves of certain elementals we must be prepared to replace elementals which are a nuisance, with more beneficial ones. When one elemental is driven out a vacuum remains which can be occupied by a new elemental of any nature. It is vital, therefore, to fill such voids with elementals that serve a constructive purpose within the personality.
We see why it is difficult for personalities to change too much, too quickly as each personality is composed of a relatively balanced and interdependent network of elementals. Suddenly to remove either large elementals, or a collection of elementals of a like kind, can seriously de-stabilize an individual, leading even to madness. The work of dis-energizing elementals must be slow and steady with much resolve.
Elementals can never be defeated in a direct struggle. We believe that in order to move beyond the chains of the past it is best to recognize their source – using reason – and then work to replace and transcend them. We need to let go of, and not dwell on, past events. In letting go of the past — which is behind us and unchangeable –, we dis-energize the elementals that weigh us down, depriving them of their life-blood. We can then live unfettered in the present. Let today belong to today, and not the pull of yesterday, nor the push of tomorrow.
From the Esoteric Teachings book by Dr. Stylianos Atteshlis (Daskalos)’
l also posted quite a bit in another part of the blog here:
Thanks Mike, both the comments were quite a read but very helpful. Things make much more sense now.
However, I can’t help but feel quite helpless when I think about all the bad things that happen to good people. Personal experience teaches that being naive and goody-good with peaceful and loving thoughts does not guarantee a happy life.
How do we balance the range of responses that life extracts from us.
e.g. Situation A: Bob selflessly volunteers to help people.
e.g. Situation B: Bob has to physically harm an intruder to save his family/village/country.
Situation A is relatively easy(?); Bob just thinks happy and peaceful thoughts, re-enforcing the good elementals.
In situation B, how does Bob perform the needed action without creating elementals that will come back and harm him.
Would be grateful to learn about this. Thanks
Sanjaya: However, I can’t help but feel quite helpless when I think about all the bad things that happen to good people.
Bad things happen to good people so that they can grow and become better 😉
The Mother has answered this question. See another blog post : https://auromere.wordpress.com/2009/02/17/why-bad-things-happen-to-good-people/
Sanjaya: Situation B: Bob has to physically harm an intruder to save his family/village/country.
Isn’t that the question Arjuna asked Krishna in the Gita ?
One has to rise above worshipping the Gods (including elementals, at every level) and find the Divine itself which permeates the Universe. Tnen your actions will be in tune with the Divine Will
Thanks Sandeep, the following words really helped: “The purpose of life is to evolve to full consciousness rather than remain mired in the petty joys of life. If there was no suffering or struggle, we would remain stuck in our current stage of evolutionary development.”
However, in getting ready for the struggle, don’t we create elementals that would come back and affect us. e.g. training to be in the army, police etc where overwhelming force is required. Q:How do we inculcate the “BramhaKshatra” attitude in us, without creating harmful elementals.
Sandeep: “One has to rise above worshipping the Gods (including elementals, at every level) and find the Divine itself which permeates the Universe.”
Isn’t that what Hinduism has been doing, worshipping the elementals, gods and the Supreme at the same time depending on the need. How do we rise above them except through them. I assume we worship them as they are helpful in mundane life. Please would like to know more on this.
‘Etheric vitality is the “Bread” which comes to us from Heaven.’
I disagree because it’s quite clear what Jesus said and etheric vitality is just energy in etheric body.
35 And Jesus said unto them, “I am the Bread of Life. He that cometh to Me shall never hunger, and he that believeth in Me shall never thirst.
Yes amsha, l see your point, but l don’t think Daskalos is referring to the ‘etheric body’ in the usual occult or theosophical way. l think his idea of ‘etheric vitality or bread’ is synonymous with what we call in Yoga ‘Shakti’ or ‘Prana’. As he describes it below. Yes, the Christ-Consciousness would be the source of this ‘Bread’, of course.
As you can see,he’s talking about ‘vitality’ in a much vaster sense of the word.
“Researchers of Truth understand the triadic nature of their subconscious. One chamber of the subconscious contains all the elementals composing our personality. The second chamber is the storehouse of life-giving etheric vitality. The third, and most valued chamber, is that of the Logos and the Holy Spirit.
With appropriate training, we can project and direct etheric vitality from the etheric doubles of the bodies and send it over vast distances, and perform so-called miracles. To do this we can take part of the Mind-substance of etheric vitality, give it form ands is referrin project it as a mental image, outside both our gross material body and our etheric double.”
“I am continuously creating Mind substance for you, to keep your bodies thriving. I am the living “bread of life” [John 6:48]. And I am the living water which you will drink and never thirst again [cf. John 4:10-14]. I am the Mind vitality everywhere in the world. I am Spirit and I am form. You are my Omnipresence.”
I would rather say that bread is Immanent Divine behind physical things because in Bible Jesus refers to the ordinary bread as his body and wine perhaps is Shakti with prana being lesser degree of it. But if to take Divine in the sense of Upanishads, as Ether by which all things live and breathe, it fits okay.
Thanks for making that clearer amsha 🙂
Moreover wine is a common symbol for divine bliss and blood can be Shakti.
Yes sanjay, sorry they were such long quotes lol.
‘Personal experience teaches that being naive and goody-good with peaceful and loving thoughts does not guarantee a happy life’
Yes, l agree. l know from personal experience how naivete and gullibility can lead to much humiliation and unhappiness [unless we are already some kind of saint, because the only thing that really makes us unhappy is our vanity and egoism]. Peace and Love only work when they come from the Soul, l think – otherwise we just have the ‘peace and love’ of the hippie era. Very often doing good works etc. doesn’t bring happiness because it’s subconsciously based on selfishness, as SA says in the aphorism below:
These aphorisms are from the link below:
http://www.hinduwebsite.com/divinelife/auro/auro_aphorisms.asp
226. Very usually, altruism is only the sublimest form of selfishness.
‘In situation B, how does Bob perform the needed action without creating elementals that will come back and harm him.
Like SA says below, in aphorism 229, when we slay with anger, hatred or vengeance, negative elementals are obviously created, but He says somewhere that if we have to fight, then do it without anger or hatred. l think that would possibly mean no elementals [karma] are created. Probably,the key word here is ‘Detachment’ – if there is no attachment [especially through intense emotional reaction] there can be no elemental creation, lf you see what l mean.
227. He who will not slay when God bids him, works in the world an incalculable havoc.
228. Respect human life as long as you can; but respect more the life of humanity.
229. Men slay out of uncontrollable anger, hatred or vengeance; they shall suffer the rebound now or hereafter; or they slay to serve a selfish end, coldly; God shall not pardon them. If thou slay, first let thy soul have known death for a reality and seen God in the smitten, the stroke and the striker.
l particularly like this aphorism:
295. Be not repelled by the world’s crookednesses; the world is a wounded and venomous snake wriggling towards a destined off-sloughing and perfection.
Am sorry the answers seem to bring on more questions (or maybe am just a lazy thinker).
How do we train to be able to do the “right thing” without creating harmful elementals or at least lessening their intensity.
It is easy to sit at home and think peaceful, loving thoughts. It’s the daily grind that gets us. How do we recognise the correct path of action and do what’s needed.
Is it better to stand by and watch until we learn to act properly or is it better to make mistakes however harmful they maybe and learn that way.
Thanks
Sanjaya: Is it better to stand by and watch until we learn to act properly or is it better to make mistakes however harmful they maybe and learn that way.
The same question Arjuna asked Krishna in the Gita. The answer Krishna gave was Karma Yoga. You grow in consciousness by acting and engaging the world. It is better to act (of course, with constant self-reflection) and make mistakes than to sit passively.
See https://auromere.wordpress.com/2010/09/23/how-to-act-in-a-unstable-world/
Sandeep ji!
I know you are quite busy, and was not referring to you, personally.
I am still in Pisac, Peru, with limited Internet access.
Dear Mike!
It is true that I try hard, but I still consider myself a neophite yogi.
To answer your query, this unique Kundalini Yoga I learned from the Acharya Michael Beloved (Yogi Madhvacharya), a Mahayogi. He has taught me many times in person. The acharya, now 62-63, lives like a hobo, mostly in the Southeast US, mostly in Florida, where he is now. He is a descendant from black slaves from Guyana.
This link is for a pimer session I recorded of the Acharya recently in the backyard of my home in Miami:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h3JG8x2sH4s
He has written over 20 books, most unique as is his proficiency of the Sanskrit language, of these his 3 commentaries of the Gita, and the Yoga Sutras, are important, but perhaps his greatest is his commentary of Canto 10 of Srimad Bhagavatam, the Uddhava Gita. You can find all his books for sale in Amazon.com.
Sexual desire is not false Eros, kundalini rising can cause immense sexual pain that must be released or it can send you crazy, especially if you have blockages in your energy fields caused by stress…… The pain can feel like you are dying so must be released to keep sanity especially if it has risen spontaneously…….. x