What is the difference between having sex with multiple partners (called promiscuity) and having sex with one individual ? If there is no sign of God penalizing you, if society is not prudish about it, and if pregnancy and sexual diseases can be avoided, why limit yourself to a long and boring monogamous relationship when you can have sex with multiple partners, a few nights here, a few weeks there, over and over again? There are people who apparently live long and healthy lives despite adhering to such an obviously decadent lifestyle. While the naked eye may see nothing wrong with it (pun intended), the third eye might.
The promiscuous lifestyle articulated in the first paragraph is prevalent in large sections of Western culture today, and in an age of globalization where American movies and sitcoms are beamed across the world, it is gaining acceptance in other cultures as well. People are confused – they do not understand why religion and society has historically forbidden a fun-filled lifestyle which doesn’t seem to carry any deleterious consequences. Is morality just a set of idealistic beliefs which have no relevance to life ? If God exists, why doesn’t he indicate his choice by penalizing the sinners ?
To answer these questions, I am going to repost an article posted earlier by a friend on his blog. This answer comes from an Indian Guru named Sadhguru Jaggi Vasudev and utilizes an ancient Indian concept called Runanubandha.
“Today, we are living in a culture where it is not necessary that you have lived with one partner all your life. Things have changed. I mean, a partner comes with an expiry date. When you made the relationship you thought this is forever, but within three months you think, “Oh, why the hell am I with this person?” Because it is all going by what you like and what you do not like. Because of this, it is always off and on, off and on. When it is broken and when it is unstable, you will go through enormous pain and suffering, which is totally unnecessary. If you do this exercise of falling in and out of love too often, if you go on playing around with too many people, after some time you will become numb, you do not like anybody because there is something called Runanabandha.
Runanabandha is a certain aspect of karma; it is a certain structure of karmic substance. It happens because of a certain amount of meeting and mingling that happens between people. Wherever there is a certain amount of meeting and mingling, some runanabandha is created. Especially when two bodies come together, the runanabandha is much deeper. It is a kind of recording in the body; the body is keeping a record of everything that has happened. If intimacy happened with another body, it is keeping a record of that particular kind of energy.
Now because the body remembers, if there are multiple partners, the body slowly gets confused over a period of time and this confusion will tell in your life in a million different ways. Your mind is confused, but you are living with that somehow. If the body gets confused, then you are in deep trouble.
In many ways, one of the major reasons for the level of anxiety, the level of insecurity, and the level of depression that is going on right now is just that the bodies are confused. After some time, you do not need any reason to go nuts. People are just going nuts without any reason because the body itself is confused.
Body gets confused with multiple intimacies, that is one thing. Another thing is the type of food that you eat. Whenever a little affluence comes, people think they have to eat everything in a single meal. In India, orthodox people never ate more than two or three items in a meal, and those three items were always matched together, not mismatched food. People understood the body so well that in our homes, they knew that when they cook a particular vegetable, they will make only a particular kind of curry. When they cook this vegetable, another kind will never be made because traditionally, they understood that if they put this and that together, the body gets confused.
As young boys, we were trained – if we go to the market, how we should pick up the vegetable. These days it is totally gone, but when I was young they trained me – when we go to the market, “If you buy this vegetable, you do not buy that because these two cannot be eaten within a span of two days. If you have eaten this, you should not eat that,” because the body will get confused. Once your body gets confused you will go haywire in so many ways. This understanding was always there.
What I see is, if you go to any affluent dinners, it has become madness. Recently in one of the events, someone was very proudly announcing that they have 270 different varieties of food. People take a little of everything and eat. The body gets confused with this kind of food.
So these are two major things – people not eating properly and an indiscriminate sense of intimacy with other bodies – which will create certain confusion on the body level which will take a toll over a period of time. “So have I committed a sin? Is this a punishment for me?” It is not on that level. Every action has a consequence. This is not a moralistic reality; it is a certain existential process. If you do certain things with your mind, certain consequences will come. If you do certain things with your body, certain consequences will come.
These are things that have been deeply understood and life was structured in a certain way around that. Now, in the name of freedom we want to demolish everything and suffer. Maybe centuries later we will realize that this is not the way to live.”
Les Demoiselles d’Avignon (young ladies of Avignon) by Pablo Picasso. Click image for source.
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- Further remarks on sexuality
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Integral Yoga of Sri Aurobindo & The Mother 
Udayana notes that formerly offspring were mind-born; then they were produced by sexual union for the sake of progeny; later they were simply the unintended consequence of copulation to satisfy lust; and now, in the Kali Yuga, copulation occurs with almost total disregard for time and place, following the custom of beasts
from the Nyaya-Kusumanjali of Udayanacarya (10th Century CE)
as quoted in (Mackenzie-Brown, Hindu Perspectives on Evolution, London ; New York : Routledge, 2012, p 43)
Brother Sandeep,
Very thoughtful article.Thank you so much.You have truly reached a higher level of consciousness.
But this article has no insights from me! 🙂
Dr Paul Pearsall investigated many fascinating cases where memories of heart donors were transferred to the transplant recipients. His work was covered in an earlier article on “Memory transference in organ transplant recipients“.
While Dr Pearsall did not use the word Runanubandha, he reached the same conclusions seen in the above article. He concluded that there may be no such thing as “casual sex”, because every sexual encounter results in an intermingling of a deeper energy-field of the participants.
In his book, “The Heart’s Code: Tapping the Wisdom and Power of Our Heart Energy“, he wrote:
(Paul Pearsall, The Heart’s code, Broadway Books, 1999, p 178)
See his website http://www.paulpearsall.com/
Bonjour Sandeep,
Oui, il est évident que les 2 points soulignés sont très importants. Il ne s’agit pas de moraliser . Il suffit de constater.
Sandeep, ce que vous racontez au sujet de votre enfance et de la nourriture à acheter au marché est très intéressant: les gens étaient plus sages que maintenant.
Que vont devenir nos enfants gavés d’internet , de téléphones portables et de jeux vidéos ?
Sandeep j’aimerais savoir dans quelle région de l’Inde avez vous grandi ?
Cordialement,
Jean- Pierre
(For the benefit of other readers, I have appended an English translation of your comment — SANDEEP)
Yes, it is obvious that the two points raised are very important. It is not to moralize. It suffices to note.
Sandeep, what you’re saying about your childhood and the way you bought food at the market is very interesting: people were wiser then.
What will become of our children addicted to the internet, mobile phones and video games?
Sandeep I would like to know in which region of India did you grow up?
Jean-Pierre,
The explanation given above is not mine. It was given by an Indian Guru named Jaggi Vasudev. It is he, not me, who is talking about his experience of buying food at the market. His observations might appeal to you because the French are known to treasure their countryside and love to shop for fresh produce at their markets.
Yes, sexual restrictions have been wrongly clubbed under morality when they really have to be observed to facilitate the growth of human consciousness (and enable you to find the right partner for this life)
It was the historical revolt against the cumbersome sexual restrictions imposed by the Roman Catholic Church combined with the influence of Freudian psychology (which discourages any form of sexual repression) that has given rise to the current culture of promiscuity in the West. There are of course other factors which also contributed to it like the industrial revolution, the invention of the birth control pill, and the rescinding of obscenity laws in the 1950s in favour of Free Speech. (see Samuel Roth vs United States 1957 case which protected obscene speech followed by other cases like “Alberts vs California 1957” listed under Obscene speech and First Amendment which weakened Comstock laws)
The underlying assumption in Western culture is that we have just one life and we must enjoy it as much as we can without repressing any emotion. On the other hand, Indian culture, which revolves around the concept of Karma and reincarnation, encourages right action (Dharma) which would eventually lead towards Self-realization (Moksha). From the standpoint of Indian philosophy, free sex seems like a bad idea.
As for your concern about kids being addicted to video games, all I can say is that society oscillates between extremes so one can’t do much about it. After a period of materialistic indulgence, people usually get depressed and tired and start inquiring for the source of real happiness. That is why we have to go through multiple incarnations. All we can do is to work towards our own Self-realization in the meantime.
“As for your concern about kids being addicted to video games, all I can say is that society oscillates between extremes so one can’t do much about it.”
Merci Sandeep pour ce long développement. Vous évoquez l’hypothèse de la réincarnation. Cette hypothèse ouvre effectivement une perspective. Mon background occidental n’a pas présent à l’esprit cette perspective. Même si les textes des sages indiens font partie maintenant de mon référentiel culturel je n’ai pas expérimenté de souvenirs de vie antérieure. Et je dois ajouter que je suis libre de toute croyance. Mais la vie est un yoga, n’est-ce -pas ?
Yes, reincarnation has to be regarded as a perspective and a hypothesis in the absence of incontrovertible and repetitive evidence. In the absence of reincarnation as a motivating factor, I guess all one can do is to educate people on the consequences of their actions but only up to a point. After all, every individual is endowed with free-will.
Coming back to the topic of children, all parents wrestle with the problem of wanting to prevent their children from falling into vices. The Mother referred to it once.
Question: Sometimes it so happens that amother educates her child well, but the people around spoil it. Then what can the mother do?
Yes, that’s perfectly true. The worst of all (which men usually do) is to leave their children with servants. It is a crime. For these people have an altogether vulgar consciousness, altogether low, altogether obscure; and quite spontaneously, without wanting to do so, they let it enter the children. Naturally, there is also the age when children are put to school and there they begin to come in contact with a host of children whose company is not always quite desirable. It is very difficult to avoid these relations. But all the same, if one has started life with a little consciousness and much goodwill, when one meets people who are not desirable company, one feels it. And if one is goodwilled, immediately one tries not to see them or not to be with them.
Question: But if the power of ill-will is greater than the other person’s goodwill?
Mother: Yes, that’s true, that may happen. Fundamentally, this is why we always come back to the same thing: one must do all one can, as well as possible, and do it as an offering to the Divine, and then, once all this is settled and organised, well, if there is really an aspiration in the being, and a being that is a being of light, it can counteract all bad influences. But once one puts one’s foot into this world, one can’t hope very much to be quite pure and free from bad influences. Every time one eats, one absorbs them; every time one breathes, one absorbs them. Then, essentially, what is necessary is to do the work of cleansing, progressively, as much as possible.
(Collected Works of the Mother, vol 5, p 412)
Jean-Pierre
Obviously, an ‘addiction’ to video games, as to anything, would be unhealthy. At what point though does regular use of something become an addiction? If, say, one were to practice meditation for at least 3 hours every day for 30 years, would one class that as addiction?
I myself have played video games extensively over the past 30 years. Sometimes for 3 hours at a time, sometimes for a good deal longer. During these sessions one tends to maintain a certain mental focus, an almost trance-like one-pointed concentration; one had to if one was to defeat those pesky end-of-level Guardians.
In the early days of the micro-computer one invariably lacked the facility to save one’s game progress to disk so at the end of each session one was forced to turn off the computer and lose everything one had achieved thus far, as a result one soon learned not to remain attached to the fruits of one’s work, an essential teaching of the Bhagavad Gita I believe, not that we knew it at the time.
So yes, Jean-Pierre, All Life IS Yoga! 😉
(I don’t speak French)
“I have known in my life persons who called themselves ‘materialists’ and yet followed a much severer discipline than those who claim to do yoga.
What we want is that humanity should progress; whether it professes to lead a yogic life or not matters little, provided it makes the necessary effort for progress.”
~ The Mother, 25 December 1950.
Ian: I myself have played video games extensively over the past 30 years. Sometimes for 3 hours at a time, sometimes for a good deal longer. During these sessions one tends to maintain a certain mental focus, an almost trance-like one-pointed concentration; one had to if one was to defeat those pesky end-of-level Guardians.
We have to differentiate between different types of “concentration” depending on whether the said activity:
1) raises the mental consciousness OR blunts it.
2) widens the consciousness OR narrows it.
Concentrating on a video game generally makes the mind dull (exceptions can be made for flight-training programs). A game is a repetitive task where the mind does not rise above its rational level and remains self-absorbed. Concentrating on a difficult math problem or composing a piece of music/poem is qualitatively different because it raises and widens your consciousness above your body.
The simple definition of addiction is a habit that you can’t break easily. Most video games seem to trap you into a dazzling screen replete with exciting sensory stimulations. I would say its similar to an self-absorbed reading of a sexually-titillating novel from start to finish. Both are forms of concentration but they lead to no elevation of consciousness.
Hindus And Muslims Most Likely To Abstain From Premarital Sex According To New Study
“All major world religions discourage sex outside of marriage, but they are not all equally effective in shaping behavior,” said Amy Adamczyk of the John Jay College of Criminal Justice, who co-authored the study with John Jay doctoral student Brittany E. Hayes.
Drawing on the Demographic and Health Surveys funded by the U.S. Agency for International Development, the study included data from 31 developing nations collected between 2000 and 2008. The authors focused on individuals’ responses to questions on religious affiliation, marital status, and sexual behavior outside of marriage.
Adamczyk said the study evolved from another study she was doing that found countries with large Muslim populations have very low rates of HIV and AIDS. “I was trying to figure out why that would be,” she said. One reason she considered was lower rates of sex outside of marriage.
The authors hypothesized that the larger the proportion of Muslims and Hindus in a country, the lower the rates of premarital and extramarital sex.
Adamczyk and Hayes found that 94 percent of Jews in the nations they studied reported having premarital sex, compared to 79 percent of Christians, 65 percent of Buddhists, 43 percent of Muslims and 19 percent of Hindus.
As for extramarital sex, 4 percent of Jews reported having sex outside of marriage, compared to 3 percent of Christians. Less than one percent each of Muslims, Hindus and Buddhists reported having extramarital sex.
Read more @
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/10/29/premarital-sex-hindus-muslims-abstain_n_2030650.html
As you can see at the end of the blog post, one of the people who “liked” this post is a woman whose life is currently a mess :
http://en.gravatar.com/sexandtheshameless
” I’m female, 23, single, a stripper, in therapy and completely clueless. I’m writing this blog to try and understand why i behave the way i do. I’ve destroyed so many relationships of my own and other’s because of my destructive and promiscuous behavior. I’m like a kid in a sweet shop when it comes to dating, i can’t have just one……. ”
One can’t tell anything definite from these social studies but here is another one which was just recently posted
Fresh evidence that a relatively late sexual initiation is likely to lead to a happier romantic relationship
According to new research, people who lose their virginity at an older age are less likely to marry and tend to have fewer romantic partners in adulthood. But those who do end up in a committed relationship in later adulthood tend to be happier with their partners than their peers whose first sexual intercourse came at an earlier age.
The study was conducted by Paige Harden, a professor at the University of Texas’ psychology department in Austin. The study investigated how early sexual initiation can affect romantic relationships in adulthood. It explored whether people get married or live with their partners, how many romantic partners they’ve had, and whether they are satisfied with their relationships.
[….]
“Individuals who first navigate intimate relationships in young adulthood, after they have accrued cognitive and emotional maturity, may learn more effective relationship skills than individuals who first learn scripts for intimate relationships while they are still teenagers,” Harden said, according to a report released by the university.
from
http://www.openthemagazine.com/article/science/can-t-hurry-love
My friend has a very active Casual sexual life with a guy , I wanted to wait till marriage . Now she is also turning spiritual , but I this is because she wants to marry me ! Will her karma affect me as well , I doubt if I can ever forget her past ( I am not that great yet )
Sorry, do not know and cannot help
Thank You Sandeep. This is a very good lesson you have shared by Sadhguru Jaggi Vasudev. I am interested in learning more about the food aspect also. Is this taught in ayurvedic medicine? Can you refer any lessons or books on the topic for further insight/study?
“Body gets confused with multiple intimacies, that is one thing. Another thing is the type of food that you eat.” ~Sadhguru Jaggi Vasudev
Also, I think this is interesting, I am single and I have had many opportunities to explore promiscuity, but when the opportunities had surfaced I felt no compulsion to follow through. As a matter of fact, for some reason, most of my life I have desired to live independently. This was not due to any discipline or mastery, but rather a subtle impression I sensed to abstain. And I’m no angel either, I had three interactions with the opposite sex in my life time (I’m 51). And it has been 20+ years since the last time.
Also, I would like to know more about returning the body to a state of equilibrium once it has been confused. And is this confusion physically obvious? … this raises so many questions….
Thank you!
Mark
Mark: I am interested in learning more about the food aspect also. Is this taught in ayurvedic medicine? Can you refer any lessons or books on the topic for further insight/study?
I know next to nothing about ayurvedic eating, because I am a victim of India’s secular education policy which doesn’t teach kids much about their ancient heritage 🙂 In my own case, I evolved from indulgent eating to restrained eating; I eat whatever keeps my body and mind in an alert and fresh state.
There are plenty of websites and books on the ayurvedic eating though. If I find something relevant, I will add a comment later.
Mark: Also, I would like to know more about returning the body to a state of equilibrium once it has been confused.
The body equilibrium is naturally restored through Yoga when the Higher Light/Consciousness descends into the body and purges the memory of the past. It takes time but it is worth the effort. In any case, death ultimately erases the body after which one might carry the seeds of Karma into some future life.
Mark: And is this confusion physically obvious? … this raises so many questions….
I haven’t been through multiple intimacies so I can only speculate on what confusion might occur 🙂
This confusion could express itself in a discord between the longings of the inner psychic being and the body. For example, the body may lust for those who are sexually attractive, while the inner psychic longs for someone who is spiritually compatible. In this internal acrimony, it is the body which might win in the short term leading to choice of unstable partners in life; it is basically the kind of self-destructive behaviour which we see in people who breakup with mature partners in order to engage in a dalliance with the more adventurous ones.
Another problem which might develop is skin hunger, of which we find a reference in the journal of Ken Wilber.
I know next to nothing about ayurvedic eating, because I am a victim of India’s secular education policy which doesn’t teach kids much about their ancient heritage
Well, looks like the education specialists in India are waking up. CBSE in India which decides curriculum for many central schools has introduced a new course “Knowledge Traditions and Practices of India” where students can learn about ancient Indian developments in astronomy, math, philosophy, metallurgy, ayurveda, music, etc
Read the circular here
http://nikhilsheth.blogspot.com/2012/10/knowledge-traditions-and-practices-of.html
Another possible manifestation of confusion that I forgot to add…
Mark: And is this confusion physically obvious? … this raises so many questions….
When two people have been married for a long time, they tend to develop similar preferences and outlook for life. This is partly because there is a subconscious exchange going on during sexual intercourse.
Now when you have sex with multiple partners, you might find your subconscious loaded with all kinds of contradictory and unstable impulses which have been absorbed from all these people.
Thank You Sandeep. These additional comments gave me the insight I needed both on food and the body. I understand. 🙂 And I am quite new to Sri Aurobindo’s Yoga (3 plus years), although I have been in a spiritual discipline for most of my life.
To understand all the historical forces which shaped American sexual culture and transformed it into its present form, see these books.
Peter Stearns. Sexuality in World History. New York : Routledge, 2009.
Angus McLaren. Twentieth-century sexuality : a history. Oxford, UK : Blackwell Publishers, 1999.
James R. Petersen. Century of Sex. New York : Grove Press, 1999.
The current definition of “consensual sex” seems to stem from a 1958 book “Sex without Guilt” which urged every individual to avail himself of every form of sexual pleasure without feeling embarrassed:
“Every human being, just because he exists, should have the right to as much (or as little), as varied (or as monotonous), as intense (or as mild), as enduring (or as brief) sex enjoyments as he prefers – as long as, in the process of acquiring these satisfactions, he does not needlessly, forcefully, or unfairly interfere with the sexual (or nonsexual) rights and satisfactions of others.” (Stearns, Sexuality in World History, p 142)
Neuroscientists have found that married men can be prevented from committing adultery by injecting them with a hormone ! These men stay 8 more inches away from an attractive women
Fidelity hormone
The study, which was led by René Hurlemann of University of Bonn, found that men in committed relationships who were given oxytocin kept a greater distance when approaching or being approached by an unknown woman they found attractive compared with those given a placebo. In contrast, oxytocin had no effect on single men.
A total of 86 heterosexual men, around half of whom were single, participated in the study. Either an oxytocin or placebo nasal spray was administered to them. After 45 minutes, an attractive woman was made to walk towards them. The men themselves were instructed to walk towards the woman and say when they felt their ‘ideal distance’ was met, and at what point it made them feel ‘slightly uncomfortable’.
Those men who were in committed relationships and had received oxytocin were found to keep the largest distance. They preferred to stay 28–30 inches away from the woman, compared with the 20–24 inches preferred by those in committed relationships who had received placebos. Even single men who had received oxytocin maintained a 20-24 inches distance. The men in relationships stayed farther away from the woman than the single men, regardless of whether the woman averted her gaze or looked directly at them.
Among other findings, it also showed that oxytocin had no affect on the distance men kept from another man.
from
http://www.openthemagazine.com/article/science/fidelity-hormone
Feels like an offence against masculine nature.
New type of infidelity
Has Your Online Friendship Crossed the Line? by Sheri Myers
There’s a new kind of infidelity that’s destroying marriages and wreaking havoc among committed couples. It’s called emotional sex.
[…]
When we feel restless and dissatisfied with our relationships, instead of working on it, we become addicted to our electronic gadgets. They offer us the kind of instant gratification and validation that’s not always easy to get from our partners. We turn to our laptops, tablets and cellphones for the kind of attention, stimulation and intimacy we crave. As a result, our relationships are suffering. Divorce rates are increasing, infidelity stats are rising and social media is increasingly to blame; Facebook, as an example, is reportedly being cited in over 30% of divorce cases as the cause of the breakup. More and more men and women are cheating, and much of the cheating starts — or is being fueled — online.
[…]
Take this 60-second reality check quiz from my book “Chatting or Cheating” to see whether it’s just chatting or if you’re really cheating
Read the rest @
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/sheri-meyers/has-your-online-friendshi_b_2220823.html
btw….I never get the thing with promiscuity (although I had been quite promiscuous a long time ago!) Sex is quite boring after the initial phase and one gets to know the sexual partner. There are only so many positions and creative things one can try and after that it becomes a routine. Usually one has to work hard to keep the ‘fires burning’ in the bed and an orgasm only last for 1 min at best. Sorry for the rant, but I always felt quite unattracted to sexual relationships, also one cannot have sex with a lot of partners since all these societal rules always apply! Free sex was a nice fantasy we all indulged in as tweens but then the fantasy wears off and reality strikes….it’s impossible to really have “freedom” sexually anyways 😦
For once, I shuddered after reading your comment and wondered if I need a comment moderation policy on this blog 🙂
Nizken: Usually one has to work hard to keep the ‘fires burning’ in the bed and an orgasm only last for 1 min at best
Spiritual ecstasy lasts much longer !
And one doesn’t have to work so hard 🙂
And one becomes free of diseases instead of contracting STDs
Nizken: I never get the thing with promiscuity
I still didn’t get the gist of your comment. What are you trying to convey ? That promiscuous behaviour is inevitable but declines after a while ? Or that sexual expression is a “NEED”, that sex is natural and must be viewed in positive light, as the liberal American rhetoric goes these days.
There exist different types of infidelity but the term ’emotional sex’ just makes me wonder if has been coined to get more audience………few years back i came across the word ‘Sapiosexual’ described as one f***ing with brain. No need to say, it became very popular on social networking websites amongst intellectual wannabes……
As for infidelity…..its a complete lack of responsibility towards everyone involved! On the worse side of it, i have even seen the families where the women quitely accept it as it gives them more dominant position within the family (support from extended family, kids, friends and also a possibility to exploit the guilt of the person involved)……..and so it can become a never ending attack of adverse forces!
“For once, I shuddered after reading your comment and wondered if I need a comment moderation policy on this blog”
Yes, it’s all getting a little risque, LOL.
l only have to put the TV on after 9.pm and you can guarantee there will be some kind of sexual feeding frenzy somewhere.
Wait, noooo I never meant any of those things, you have misunderstood my intent. Sorry my comment was a bit too factual and derogatory about sex. I wasn’t taking any sides at all but just giving my experiences with sex and having multiple partners. My intent was only to say that sexual intercourse is not all that grand as it is made out to be…..Nothing more. I think people spend way too much time over a very boring and useless activity called sex. I have been celibate for over 5 years now and never regretted it.
Nizken: My intent was only to say that sexual intercourse is not all that grand as it is made out to be
Well, this depends on where you stand on the evolutionary path.
Those who are in the lower stages tend to have an insatiable sexual appetite throughout life while those who are higher are relatively free of any such urges. In between there is the whole spectrum of possibilities – people sliding back and forth, between Bed, Bath and Beyond !!
It is all based on the Gunas – Sattwa, Rajas, Tamas – that you cultivated in your past lives. That is why one cannot impose any uniform prescription on people – like expecting all people to get married, have children and live for God or whatever.
I wanted your opinion on a related matter as well. Should one live like a spartan and avoid music, popular movies and entertainment? I always have been drawn to living an ascetic lifestyle but have a small corner in my heart for good music. Not rap or the pop charts style music thankfully! I didn’t find any prohibitions against music or art etc in SA & M’s letters, in fact I think the Mother used to paint and also play organ music. But what is your opinion on youtube and listening to music on a daily basis?
(Unfortunately in my case sometimes music is a way to kill time or beat boredom, something I’m trying to work on currently…)
Taste in music and movies changes when the consciousness changes from Tamasic to Sattwic.
It is true that there are no hard rules but one should observe some elementary restrictions like avoiding music and movies which are harsh, violent, highly sexual or obscene. The reason is that, unknown to you, these tenebrous sounds and images enter the subconscious and pollute it, thereby preventing the consciousness from rising into the higher worlds during dreams. It is only when you go deeper in meditation that you discover all the dark habits and tendencies that are hidden in your subconscious ! One may struggle enormously to keep one’s nose above the subconscious that rises up and disrupts meditation as well as sleep.
The Mother did speak about this – I will post the text later. If you want to read it before that, see Collected Works, vol 7, page 297 where the question is “should we take any interest in those songs which have no meaning, usually cinema songs”.
l think we have to be selective in everything we do, see, hear etc.. when it comes to the Spiritual Life. Although, l should say, l’m a little addicted to movies of all kinds. These things can drag the consciousness down to the gutter level or even the sewer, if we are not careful.
There is a good thread on here about music:
Boredom can lead us into some very silly things, which we tend to become addicted to – l know from personal experience.
I’m glad someone is speaking up against promiscuity. Whatever be the logic behind opposing promiscuity, I personally abhor promiscuity which to me is moral indiscipline and morally inappropriate because it constitutes infidelity, among other reasons. I hope more and more people , especially youngsters get the right message since currently they are virtually being led into a belief in unfettered personal liberty! Furthermore, it is matter of shame that some people even defend pornography!
Do you think we can create an world in which spirituality will reign, in which despite the advances of science and technology moral discipline can co-exist? Or is it an idealistic fantasy?
Romi: Do you think we can create an world in which spirituality will reign, in which despite the advances of science and technology moral discipline can co-exist? Or is it an idealistic fantasy?
I am afraid any kind of spiritual utopia is an idealistic fantasy. You have to recognize that souls are in different stages of evolution and process the same stimuli differently according to their temperament.
What seems abhorrent to you is always going to be perfectly acceptable to someone else. The human mind has the singular ability to argue successfully for any cause, and there will even be people who will be convinced and buy those arguments. Consequently, there will always be people who will have unrestrained sex with multiple partners, social and religious fetters notwithstanding.
The only thing we can do is to put out information based on our growing spiritual knowledge and hope for the best. Like-minded individuals will agree with you but those who haven’t reach that spiritual understanding will argue with you. People move in and out of various social circles driven by their changing ideals.
There are two books by Dr Miriam Grossman (“Unprotected” and “You are teaching my child what?”) which are aligned with this article.
Dr Grossman was a campus psychiatrist at UCLA (Univ of California, Los Angeles) where she witnessed first-hand the harmful consequences that the promiscuous culture has on students’ health.
She argues that sexual education in the USA is controlled by radical liberal ideologues (she calls them the “sex education industry”) who deliberately whitewash medical evidence against risky sexual behaviour in order to enable guilt-free sex. These liberal ideologues are so motivated by anti-Christian hatred that they end up ignoring medical evidence against promiscuity.
Dr Grossman wrote her first book anonymously because she was afraid speaking out might cost her her job as a psychiatrist. She cites significant instances where latest data from medical research is ignored in favour of “sexual freedom”. She discusses case studies of students who end up contracting sexual-transmitted diseases, experiencing emotional upheavals, and taking powerful psychotic drugs because they have not been warned properly against the dangers of promiscuity.
She writes in her book :
Excellent resource Sandeep. Thank You!
Hi Sandeep,
Very interesting blog you have here.
I am wondering whether you know of any practices which can dissolve bad impressions from the subconscious mind. If someone acquired the habit of viewing bad videos, how can one resolve the problems caused by this?
I’d appreciate any help
Tom: Very interesting blog you have here.
The wisdom of Sri Aurobindo and the Mother is working its magic 🙂
If someone acquired the habit of viewing bad videos, how can one resolve the problems caused by this?
If you find yourself watching a bad video, you should try to become aware of the intensity in your eyes, your rapid breathing pattern, the tension building in various parts of your body. After that, you should try to become aware of the back of your brain where the images are being beamed. Once you are able to do this, try to expand awareness of all the other sounds in the room. If you succeed in this effort, the videos will eventually lose their hold on you.
You need to start some practice of Yoga on the side in order to build willpower.
I answered a similar query on another thread : “What if your job requires sitting in front of the computer from morning to evening.! Does this process retard a person’s growth?”
The answer I gave there was: “If you meditate and are able to maintain mental silence for half an hour everyday, you begin to build up a reserve of mental strength which stops you from getting sucked up in this attention-draining vortex. Long term, that’s the best solution.”
Also see
How to cultivate witness consciousness and
another article on Witness consciousness and
How to increase willpower
Thank you very much for your helpful response. I understand in theory how to prevent any further occurrences of watching such videos.
Is there a way to dissolve the samskaras/impressions in the mind which are there from watching videos? Or do they stay there permanently?
The samskaras in the subconscious remain for a long time and crop up in dreams and foul up the daily mood as well. They go away only when the Higher Light penetrates the abyss and illumines that zone. Sometimes the samskaras can also be dissolved by a miracle through some Divine Grace.
Sri Aurobindo explains this transformation in the “Letters on Yoga” in the section on “Transformation of the Subconscient and the Inconscient”. These are a couple of letters he wrote to disciples on the matter:
These cravings and desires are old habits of the physical which came to it from the universal Nature and which it accepted and took as part of itself and its life. When these things are rejected by the waking consciousness they try to take refuge in the subconscient or else in what may be called the environmental consciousness and from there they press upon the consciousness trying to recover their hold or simply to recur for a time. If they are in the subconscient they come up most usually in dreams, but they may also surge up into the waking consciousness. If they come from the environment they take the form of thought-suggestions or impulses or a vague restless or disturbing pressure. It is probably this environmental pressure that you feel. When the body is full of the new consciousness, Peace and Power at the same time, then this outward pressure is felt but can no longer disturb and finally it recedes to a distance (no longer pressing immediately on the physical mind or body) and either gradually or rapidly disappears.
The dream you had was really a rising up of past formations or impressions from the subconscient. All that we do, feel or experience in life leaves an impression, a sort of essential memory of itself in the subconscient and this can come up in dreams even long after those feelings, movements or experiences have ceased in the conscious being, — still more when they have been recent and are only now or lately thrown away from the mind or vital. Thus long after one has ceased to think of old acquaintances or relatives dreams about them go on coming up from this source. So too when sex or anger no longer troubles the conscious vital, dreams of sex or dreams of anger and strife can still rise. It is only when the subconscient is cleared that they cease; meanwhile they are of not much importance (provided one understands what they are and is not affected) so long as the old movements are not allowed to recur or remain in the waking state.
Read online @ http://www.aurobindo.ru/workings/sa/24/0010_e.htm
Concentrate more on your Psychic Being and aspire for it to come to the front – nothing can disturb you then.
true!
Not entirely…
“Usually, those who become conscious of their psychic being expect that it will liberate them from vital and physical attractions and activities; they seek to escape from the world in order to live in the joy of contemplation of the Divine, and in the immutable peace of constant contact with Him. The attitude of those who want to practise Sri Aurobindo’s integral yoga is quite different. When they have found their psychic being and are united with it, they ask it to turn its gaze towards the physical being in order to act on it with the knowledge that comes from the contact with the Divine, and to transform the body so that it may be able to receive and manifest the divine consciousness and harmony.”
~ The Mother, On Education [pp. 46-7]
Firstly, we don’t know what Umesh meant when he said “True” ( I should have deleted the comment) and secondly, I don’t think this quote is relevant to the topic of sexual recklessness. When the Mother talked of transforming the body, she was speaking of supramentalizing it.
mike: Concentrate more on your Psychic Being and aspire for it to come to the front – nothing can disturb you then.
As Umesh’s comment was made within 12 hours of Mike’s preceding comment I presumed it was a response in support of that… I may, of course, be wrong.
yes, then it makes sense!
A girl at Princeton University wrote an anonymous article regretting her participation in the university’s casual sex (hookup) culture:
Love and lust in the bubble: Falling out of hooking up
… It wasn’t until the end of my sophomore year that I finally started regarding my freshman hookups as mistakes. This was partially because I had a hard time admitting that I had messed up. For me, to regret a decision was on par with saying “I screwed up big time,” which I could barely admit to myself, let alone a peer. And the desire to seem like I already knew it all, despite never having lived on my own before, kept me from asking questions when I first got to Princeton. But even if I had, there were elements of the hookup culture I would have never been able to anticipate, let alone seek advice about.
I was so sheltered and naive as a freshman that I can barely believe I am that same person today. And I just wish someone had told me that the reality of hooking up is monumentally different from what I was expecting. I wish someone had told me that you don’t get into a relationship by meeting someone on the Street and taking him home or that they won’t even text you the next day. I wish someone had told me that when a guy says, “Hey, I want to show you this really funny video, but it’s in my room,” he’s going to show you much more than a video. And the awkwardness that happens when your hookup flat out pretends you don’t exist the day after? No one warned me about that!
After our freshman year was long behind us, I was surprised to find out that my “accomplished” friend felt the same way as I did. She had never let on that she regretted any of her hookups, spinning all of those late nights into hilariously catty and intimate stories for the breakfast table. If one of my closest friends was able to hide her disappointment in her choices from me for two years, then who else on campus had been burned by the hookup culture?
I think we forget how stupid we can be at age 18, finally free from our parents, but anxious to be accepted and afraid of being alone. I used to believe that dance floor make-outs and invitations to frat formals were indicators that I was happy. I am convinced that most of my hookups happened because their occurrence assured me that I was desirable and that I was normal. It’s fine to feel desirable and normal, but it’s perverse and counterintuitive when one of the only ways I felt desirable and normal was to do something I wasn’t completely comfortable with.
Read the full article@
http://www.dailyprincetonian.com/2012/09/20/31166/
As per my own example, I think one’s upbringing determines one’s choices a lot. I was brought up in a family where I have witnessed my mother’s complete devotion to my father. So the belief in devotion to one man is what I have inherited. My parents never warned or instructed me as to not to do this or that, in terms of relationships. In fact, no one ever warned or instructed! But I was mature even during childhood! During teenage, I avoided guys who seemed interested romantically since I thought that I should be loyal to my future husband! So the question of promiscuity didn’t arise. I’m unmarried and to this day I have not yielded to men’s overtures! This is the conviction that is in my blood! It is equally true that some so-called liberal people make fun of my values, calling me “traditional” or “conservative”. And I tell them: I am morally disciplined–it is easier to become liberal like you, but can you exercise the choice of being conservative?
Sister Romi,
I salute you for your celibacy.
Thank you, that’s so kind of you!
Romi: As per my own example, I think one’s upbringing determines one’s choices a lot… During teenage, I avoided guys who seemed interested romantically since I thought that I should be loyal to my future husband
I can’t recall where but once I read an American woman saying: “You only go to prom once, but you can get married many times”.
In the American imagination, the “PROM” (the dance which is organized when you exit high school) has come to occupy disproportionate importance for some reason. The American worldview is more practical and even Darwinian, I might add. According to folklore, life is a struggle and there is no perfect mate possible; you are going to have a different partner at every stage of life. The person you lose virginity to is not necessarily the person you would raise your children with. Why is losing of virginity glorified in this culture? That is because historically it was an act of defiance against the Catholic Church which had emphasized virginity for centuries and turned marriage a sacrament. Over time, loss of virginity has become symbolically tied to coming-of-age and maturity. At an early age, you become independent from your family, which means you have to find a trustworthy mate you can rely upon. If you don’t do something, you are told (as per freudian psychology) that you risk sexual repression and the concomitant psychological problems. In this recurring process of finding a mate, it is assumed that you are going to make mistakes, so essentially it implies that you are going to kiss and have sex with many people over your lifetime.
OTOH, the Indian worldview is predominantly teleological. You are told that marriages are made in heaven, or that couples continue to meet across incarnations. That is why people stress marriage and consult horoscopes to determine compatibility and karmic connections.
Sandeep, while your explanation in the context of American culture may be right to an extent, what I observed during my 4-year stay in America was that people, including girls and boys brought up in India, “used” each other under the garb of this so-called struggle for mate! When they indulge in promiscuity, is it a conscious decision or even a subconscious intent on their part to find a mate? Is this promiscuity the result of the Darwinian struggle? Not necessarily so! A 17-year old room-mate, who freshly arrived from India, called her boyfriend at night and they slept in the same room where I was sleeping! Her conversation with me hinted that she was enjoying her youth. Further, I came across guys, brought up in India, through a matrimonial site. One of them cleverly and indirectly told me that sexual compatibility was important and that’s why he wanted to test whether I was a right fit for him! He also told me he did have relationships with a number of girls who were different from me (that is “liberal”). Another guy asked me if I liked cuddling and whether I would like to be his girlfriend. I refused. They wanted to “use” me and contacting me via a matrimonial site was a trap. The “glorification” of losing virginity has nefarious consequences —people are turned into products, they are tasted and deserted, they are deceived and betrayed.
While teleological explanation in the context of India is interesting, the belief that marriages are made in heaven is not enough to restrain people from indulging in promiscuity. In India, promiscuity is a fact, even though it is a matter of degree of prevalence.
By the way, I don’t believe in consulting horoscopes.
It’s very helpful to hear of your experiences dear sister since I’ve seen the same things growing up. Is there a lot of promiscuity in India nowadays? I’m curious to know since I have not been in India in ages.
Dear Nizken, thank you. It is difficult to tell if there is a “lot of” promiscuity in India.Perhaps not. I guess it is not rife but is increasing, though you might still come across virgins in middle or advanced ages—perhaps an endangered species! And I think there are significant regional variations within the country. What I admire is that the pious ideal of Indian womanhood has not died out as I have seen how ladies, both homemakers and professionals, are devoted to their husbands and children!
One disturbing thing I see is the role of media. Though not directly related to promiscuity, it has been eulogizing porn “stars”(is star the right word??) or nude models by calling them bold and by conferring on them the status of “celebrity.” Online media prompts users to view obscene videos or pictures by presenting them in a manner as if there’s nothing wrong! And young girls get the message that nudity is boldness and it is so easy to become a celebrity! In this process, nudity and promiscuity come to be associated with the assertion of female liberty, boldness and vindication of glamour! Looking flirtatious or hot is now considered desirable! Oh yes, one more thing. My friend who is a reporter shared with me that her male colleague told her to shed her inhibitions if she wanted to get a promotion by “pleasing” her boss. I’m glad she refused. Unfortunately, giving sexual favors is becoming a norm in almost all professional fields, including media corporations. I would call it “professional promiscuity” or a different form of prostitution. Disgusting enough! I posted somewhere that I would rather die of starvation than compromise my dignity; in response a male reader asked me to “grow up!”
Romi: What I admire is that the pious ideal of Indian womanhood has not died out
Hush! Otherwise feminists will castigate you for gender essentialism ! How dare you continue to propagate these outdated models of submissive women ? 🙂
Romi: One disturbing thing I see is the role of media. Though not directly related to promiscuity, it has been eulogizing porn “stars”(is star the right word??) or nude models by calling them bold and by conferring on them the status of “celebrity.”
Western culture has evolved out of a long history of combating hatred for centuries (witch burning, inquisition, etc) because of which it has elevated the principles of “tolerance” and “humanism” on the center-stage. According to this framework, human beings have to respected irrespective of who they are or what they do. Therefore, even a porn star gets respected as an individual. The Indian media seems to have adopted the same idea. While tolerance is a good idea which should be adopted from the West, one should not erase the distinction between virtue and vice. It is a mistake to turn porn stars into role models.
It is unfortunate that the Indian media people you allude to are unable to carefully delineate this conglomerate of ideas. They are basically monkeys – they ape the West. If a white person does something, they will follow it immediately. They get educated in Western theories of feminism, post-modernism, etc. and then proceed to regurgitate and propagate those theories during their work.
They have been taught that the West had to reject Christian dogma in order to become modern. Therefore, they assume that India must also reject Hindu tradition and become immoral in order to modernize. This is a false equivalence. Hinduism is not a religion in the sense of Christianity. In Hinduism, our lifestyle must be based on the theory of Trigunas (Sattwa, Rajas, Tamas). One must choose activities which are Sattwic in order to illumine the consciousness.
It is ironic that at a time when Indian spirituality is creating a new wave of American Brahmins, American sexuality is being exported to India and creating a new breed of Indian Sudras. Two-way traffic indeed!
Interesting explanation! As for my allusion to “pious ideal”, I don’t find it necessarily indicative of submission, and especially since I have held it up for myself 🙂
I was attempting to capture some of the thinking which has led to the current state. No theory can be general enough to cover the entire population of a country.
Every person that you have sex with leaves a residue in your subconscious in the form of imperceptible ticsand tendencies that are picked up by the human consciousness. Many of these young people who live promiscuous lives today are going to face the repercussions later in their old age when their energy level starts to ebb. Then their subconscious is going to overwhelm their mental acuity causing bouts of depression and loss of sleep. They will constantly need new addictions to stay happy.
Romi: One of them cleverly and indirectly told me that sexual compatibility was important and that’s why he wanted to test whether I was a right fit for him!
People who are obsessed with their physical body seek sexual compatibility. Those who aspire to rise spiritually search for spiritual compatibility.
Romi: By the way, I don’t believe in consulting horoscopes.
I have found from experience that they work. Not all astrologers have the intuitive sense, but some are unusually perceptive.
Romi Stated: My friend who is a reporter shared with me that her male colleague told her to shed her inhibitions if she wanted to get a promotion by “pleasing” her boss. I’m glad she refused. Unfortunately, giving sexual favors is becoming a norm in almost all professional fields, including media corporations. I would call it “professional promiscuity” or a different form of prostitution.
Dear Romi: Thank you for sharing on this topic. My name is Mark from California. Regarding the ‘above’ statement here are a couple articles regarding “Sexual Harassment” cases here in the US. The US no longer tolerates sexual misconduct in professional offices – it is taken very seriously and is “illegal.” It is a shame that the promotion of such is not considered harmful in the media and movie productions.
Dear Mark,
Thank you for your comment. Your mention of California reminds me of the beautiful state where I studied and worked. I witnessed high professional ethics and integrity at my workplace.
In India a bill was adopted quite recently to prevent and prohibit sexual harassment at workplace. Earlier, India’s Supreme Court exercised judicial activism and declared it a violation of fundamental rights, apart from issuing the necessary directives. But it still takes place and ladies sometimes tolerate it because it is difficult to find another job; they are not aware of grievance redressal mechanism; they want to avoid courts; they want to avoid upsetting their lives; and there are other reasons as well. And then there are ladies who find an opportunity in these favors to rise higher up!
Mark: Regarding the ‘above’ statement here are a couple articles regarding “Sexual Harassment” cases here in the US. The US no longer tolerates sexual misconduct in professional offices – it is taken very seriously and is “illegal.”
What gets quickly absorbed in India is the glamorized version of the American lifestyle as seen in sitcoms like “Friends” that run on television. The strict legal framework that underpins American society takes time to disseminate. The Indian media professionals that Romi talks about are displaying the sexism found in the Mad Men era of the 1960s.
Is it not more appropriate to use pious ideal of Indian culture here? As it applies both to men and women alike. Men are no lesser in ‘self-control’ and devotion to their partners than women i guess. I have seen many men in the generation of my grandfather, including him, who lost their wives early but did not remarry and devoted their remaining life to their kids and God.
Mansee,
Great! While your family may be having “ideal” men, I have found that impurity has made inroads into the minds of many a man, regardless of age.
I lately came across men who were married and in their 60s or early 70’s, but they craved young ladies. One of them, who was supposed to help me as a father in matrimonial matters by sharing guys’ profiles since he claimed to be doing it as part of “free” social service, tried to take advantage of me, though he had told me I was like a daughter to him. He offered me an executive position in his organization in the first meeting, even though I hadn’t asked for it! Following my first visit to his office, which resulted from his invitation to me, he visited me on some pretext and told me that I would have to visit his office “5- 6 times” so that he might “understand” me and help me better, and he even flirted saying: “Your thoughts fill my mind! I look forward to your visit.” I felt something was wrong, so I refrained from visiting him. And he, in turn, stopped emailing guys’ profiles, which revealed his true colors. In a previous meeting he had gifted me two expensive things with which I have parted in disgust! Moreover, he had asked a newspaper editor to feature my interview. But my reluctance to meet him in person made him change his mind. Unfortunately, he is not a single instance of such men.
And I guess there is no dearth of the elderly who take delight in watching porn; if given a chance or if a lady succumbs to the inducements they offer, they might commit adultery. And some would perhaps defend them, saying: “So what they are old? Why are they supposed to observe restraint? If they are not happy with their wives, it makes sense to go after young ladies!”
My intent was not to give an outlet to my anger but to expose the other side of the reality.
Romi: And I guess there is no dearth of the elderly who take delight in watching porn
Looks like you have met more than your fair share of perverts 🙂
Porn is causing major distortions in the masculine psyche in other countries as well. The Internet has really unleashed the floodgates of hell. This window to hell was opened in the US in 1957 when obscenity laws were rescinded in the historic Roth vs United States court case, where a smut peddler was given free speech protection.
Let me share a little “yogic” secret. When you advance spiritually, at some point your consciousness changes and the winds begin to flow in a different direction. It takes you closer to people who are more mature. There are tradeoffs, of course. Life may become frictionless socially, but with lesser money at your disposal. As the Mother once said, “External circumstances are a reflection of who we inwardly are”.
You wrote: As the Mother once said, “External circumstances are a reflection of who we inwardly are”.
I say: If one asks any girl or woman, I guess most will say that demons outnumber deities and this is why it is common to come across them. So though I came across “perverts” I was never harmed, and this is a miracle or a result of divine intervention. Since the topic was on promiscuity I chose not to share my personal stories of miracles as to how I came across angels in the form of nice human beings whom Goddess Durga sent whenever I was in need. I didn’t have to ask her, but she made things smooth for me in an amazing manner!
In a slightly different context, a couple of days ago I was watching a video that featured around 20 different pictures of Maa Durga, and I liked one of them the most since in it she looked like a lioness. So I told her: “If I ever remembered you Durga with a pure heart, this picture would come to me one day”. This is how I subconsciously wanted to test whether she was aware of me, whether she would respond, and whether I mattered to her! And the following day, I found the same picture in a Hindi daily. I cut it out and will keep it with me forever. Moreover, I received a red choonri from Durga’s temple on the day of my birthday(the pujari took it off her idol and gave it to me), though I didn’t ask the pujari for it nor did he know that it was my birthday.
I guess Gods make us realize their presence by first making us encounter evil forces and then helping us out!
Romi, I was talking about the ‘ideal of man in Indian culture’ and not about ‘the general men’. The ‘Ideal’ is something that has been created by us through our acceptance and at times indulgence in the moral notions of the society. It applies to everyone. Maybe there are lesser men who fulfil this criteria but they do exist. And denying or overlooking their existence will not help anyone as we will take the ‘Ideal’ away from the society and just accept or normalize the regular (pervert) behaviour.
I also have come across some old pervert men in university and job alike, but i have also had the chance to meet certain men with lot of self control and integrity. Similarly for the women, i have known the devoted ones and also the not-so-controlled ones. (Maybe it is more difficult to find pervert women as their means of expressions are more restrained than men in Indian society. Also just think in a traditional society, if a man cheats on one woman X, it will surely involve another woman Y. Now what will you call Y here?).
“Also just think in a traditional society, if a man cheats on one woman X, it will surely involve another woman Y. Now what will you call Y here?”
I would first suggest that you cool down:) since your comments reflect anger at me!
I am sorry, if you felt it that way. Do not take my comments personally. I am not angry at all.
You don’t have to say sorry, though I appreciate your response.
I didn’t deny or overlook the existence of ideal men just because I alluded to ideal women. It was an example that I shared with a reader who wanted to know about the extent of promiscuity, which was based on my personal observations.My own family has ideal men though! You are free to respond to that reader by sharing your own observations! Moreover, when I said that one might come across virgins in their advanced ages in India, I didn’t single out females! And if you read my previous comments carefully, you will find that I alluded to promiscuity prevailing among both males and females.
By the way, a critical note brings out deeper issues. My mention of moral degradation of the elderly was meant as a contribution to this discussion–addition of an aspect of promiscuity or such proclivity. I think this is an advantage of a healthy discussion when different voices are heard and appreciated.
well all i can say is…nobody really needs to ‘worry’ about spiritual degradationof society..we need to worry only about giving our best to spreading the light of spirituality and bathin in it ourselves..coz..even if we follow the Darwinian concept of SURVIVAL OF THE FITTEST..which West is so mad about…we can easily see how ultimately spirituality is bound triumph as it produces the most powerful of humans..mentally,physically,emotionally..
“And I tell them: I am morally disciplined–it is easier to become liberal like you, but can you exercise the choice of being conservative”
Yes, exactly. They can’t make that choice because they’re slaves to the lower nature, and have very little control over it – in fact it controls them.
Those who aren’t on a Spiritual Path or don’t have Spiritual leanings will never understand those who do. lt takes a Spiritual awakening for this to happen – they just ridicule us until then.
Yes, Mike. I appreciate your mention of Spiritual awakening.
Nizken, it is for you as you asked the levels of promiscuity in India.
India is currently facing bigger problems like scarcity of brides in Punjab/Haryana, which if not tended to immediately can lead to disastrous results for any society.
http://www.thehindu.com/news/national/article2400857.ece
Another shameful reporting from Haryana –
http://tehelka.com/child-mothers/
(Sandeep: This is not relevant to the current topic, i did not know where to put it. But wanted to share it, so that people here can see the other side of India as well. The part of the society that we have to work on. It looks to me that north Indian states are under some kind of eclipse! You can remove or transfer it under the relevant topic of discussion. Thanks)
I am not really good at moderating so its hard to decide what to edit or delete. Maybe we should just stop the discussion here, because it has veered off the course.
“The part of the society that we have to work on. It looks to me that north Indian states are under some kind of eclipse.”
Yes Mansee, l had that impression when the whole of Northern India had that blackout a short while ago [l mentioned it on here at the time]. l don’t think it was at all coincidental. l think lt was definitely a symbolic indication of what is hanging over that part of the country right now.
Yeah, blackout was a shame. It affected not only north India but also eastern and north eastern regions of the country. In fact, according to IBN Live, “the worst sufferers were 265 miners who got trapped in coal mines in West Bengal and Jharkhand,” which are non-northern states.
North India is certainly giving out disturbing signals, especially in terms of human development. Unfortunately, the other regions of the country have their own share of grave problems that are either similar to some extent or entirely specific to them such as the gruesome naxal insurgency! While the courageous Sikhs, Jats and Rajputs of North India, and heroes from other regions, are valorously defending the country against external forces, I wish we conquer the internal problems in the same spirit. I pray for the entire country!
Note: Sandeep, I had to respond! Sorry.
Sandeep: I have found from experience that they (astrology) work.
Just curious, is astrology capable of saying anything about a person’s spirituality or is it only material? For instance, SA or Vivekananda (or any spiritual being), would astrology be able to guess correctly that they’d become sanyasins etc.?
For astrological predictions which were made regarding Sri Aurobindo and Swami Vivekananda, see the comments under Sri Aurobindo and the Mother on Astrology
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Can anybody enlighten me what the diet this Guru mentioned in this article? Is it just sattvic diet or its something different?
No idea. You can post the question on one of his forums.
I felt very sorry and dissapointed, by the way of your answering, I had very much high opinion about you sandeep , that you are a selected person and dedicated by doing such a sacrifised divine work to answer the question by the people,even if you dont answer ,no problem but the way you answered does not suit you . there is difference between the student and the teacher , the disciple and the guru ,lay man and learned man, i think you dont want to answer , no problem i dont give you the trouble of irritating you any more , sorry once again
I am not a selected person for any Divine work! I am quite busy these days with my professional work, so I might seem brusque in my replies.
And I would still encourage you to do some preliminary reading. Many of the questions you ask are already answered in the Collected Works of the Mother or in the Letters on Yoga.
The problem with promiscuity is that sex in general for me is something personal&emotional it not an activity like brushing my teeth or playing video games or doing any other extra curricular activity.
Promiscuity is cool with me its just my cup of tea… i cannot just casually have sex with multiple women and be cool with it.. i would just end up developing feelings for all these women and i DO NOT want that.
Stupid typo.. i meant to say “Not my cup of tea” lol
Glad you got it figured out !
The Sadhguru who is quoted in the above article is now plagiarizing Rabindranath Tagore
Quote from Sadhguru : “The intellect is a reasonably sharp knife. If you do not know how to hold it, you keep cutting yourself. #QOTD”
Rabindranath Tagore had said, “A mind all logic is like a knife all blade. It makes the hand bleed that uses it.”
http://www.goodreads.com/quotes/25641-a-mind-all-logic-is-like-a-knife-all-blade
Sadhguru is caught plagiarizing another quote, this time from Sartre
I thought this was a joke at first glance! I had never heard of this guru before.
Hello.
I dont know this is right place, but what if you cant do things you like, and this creates suffering in you, for example you cant get girlfriend or sex…. its intense feeling which can even make you feel good, like cutting yourself for some people maybe :O?
Is this similar with divine feeling you. because its so strong,
Christianity may have elevated suffering to a sublime state, but no, the suffering created by torment/frustration is not Divine. These suppressed feelings lie dormant in the subconscious and create havoc later by rising up in dreams or waking state.
Meditate. Learn to master your breath and calm your mind. That erases the subconscious residues, albeit slowly.
thank you for the answer. To be fair it doesnt bother me and im not religious, but when i think about it it makes me cry, and fire feeling in the chest,.like i heard people in near statue they start to cry suddenly, which considered good thing 🙂 so i thought there are some similarities between those 🙂 its easy for me hold distance in mind and not consider it bad thing which could lead you depression ..
It may take time to realize this, but Self-pity is also a form of ego.
i understand what you mean, completely. thank you for still replying :).. in that circumstance if you dont use ego you will be in very bad state negatively :O
its like you being pushed in corner, where you are forced to harm someone to save another human or jumping front of bullet to protect other person, 😛
Site with people complaining about promiscuity… Yay for the internet.
Have you guys seen movie Easy A? It’s about virgin that pretends she’s a prostitute to gain popularity, it’s ridiculous. One of few comedies that I actually like. Oh, and christians were ‘praying for her’, of course.
I’m celibate for long, long, long time (since forever) and I have to say I don’t agree with Sandeep, I still have some of the problems that promiscuous people have. I guess my high libido is above barriers and I still have problems due to my libido even though I’m not acting on it, lol. It got a little tiny bit better over the years (very little). Skin hunger made me laugh, I have this, heh. It’s not even about sex, I just want someone to touch my face (and everything else, lol). Does bland diet make a difference? I see taoist scriptures recommend bland, vegetarian diet, yoga too I guess? I eat mainly vegetarian (I do eat salmon once in a few months) but I use a lot of spices. Like, tons. I don’t eat sweets, drink alcohol, smoke, drink coffee (only rarely one cup on business meetings), etc.
So, what I wanted to say… ah! I really enjoy my celibate lifestyle and it suits my personality. I’m completely, totally, not romatic and I hate relationships. Marriage is like worst nightmare for me. And that’s what annoys me, christians/protestants promote celibacy before marriage and then sex in marriage for procreation. I was raised protestant (quickly went atheist, couldn’t stand these group kumbajajas) and there’s basically no info for people like me, they’re just interested in turning me into breeding machine to produce new believers, I assume. Not interested. So I assumed since I hate relationships, one night stands are the only option for such people. But it’s not true at all. It turns out even some historical scientists were celibate, I guess because they were too busy with their work! Relationships take a lot of time, even loose ones, and even with loose ones they’re still a form of relationship, and that’s what people engaging in such things are trying to avoid in the first place. So, back to scientists. That’s the ideal for me, not ‘good wife’ and IMO world would be a better place if religions would take personal preferences, strengths and personality into account and not try to force the same thing on all people and make them unhappy. I was always depressed when I was protestant. One size doesn’t fit all. If I knew right away that I had an option of becoming celibate permanently and focus on my work and hobbies maybe I wouldn’t think about promiscuity in the first place.
you may not agree with me but you are clearly enjoying the blog.
thats good 😉
Have you seen Sexual Compulsives Anonymous? I got that link from Celibate FAQ.
http://www.sca-recovery.org/
I went there to compare, but to my surprise some tendencies actually sound familiar. Huh. Like, most of them started to masturbate at a young age, sounds familiar. Wow, nice to see what I prevented. These people are in really bad condition. It’s like… type of mental illness? Their life is a mess. And if someone with such strong libido can be lifelong celibate, everyone can, lol. I also like that they have their budget right in the newsletter (it’s ngo), it’s nice to see how other ngos do stuff.
i feel it all depends what chemistry you have. For some its better the less peoples you interract the better.
But it can take lot of time to reach certain enlightment level where it doesnt disturb you at all being celibate, but if you live in society and have feelings for someone then sex is crucial as it leads to highest form of enlightment too as two bodies mix together. But like i said its different for everybody, all depends how your life is
Both sides win lol
What a beautiful explanation. Thank you so much for this. I recently met a woman from western world and thought she was my soulmate but i ignored her past and suffered a lot. But this article has helped me understand what went wrong and why did she behave that way.
if you dont mind can you tell what was wrong with her past that affected you.
“but if you live in society and have feelings for someone then sex is crucial as it leads to highest form of enlightment too as two bodies mix together”
Sorry Ray, i can’t see that. lt might be alright if you follow someone like Osho [total fraud imo], but i think it will lead to a Spiritual downfall at some point.
l think along tantric lines it’s practiced at a very advanced stage, but only when your more or less enlightened anyway and you have total control over emissions [because the energy needs to be directed upwards, l think].
Yes, it all depends on which path you follow, but a genuine Spiritual path will always require celibacy i believe. Most of the fake gurus have been sex molesters who fell from the path. Anyway, i’ve never heard that it ‘Leads to Enlightenment’ as you say – that would be walking a razors edge.
Sri Aurobindo said sex-indulgence will interfere with the working of the Force. He was asked about tantric sex between two people and said you have to be ‘beyond human’ to even comprehend it.
Swami Satyananda Saraswati talks about the tantric approach in his book – Sure Ways to Self-Realization. [Although there are rumours about him molesting female disciples].
The Mother didn’t say ‘sex is a terrible slavery’ for nothing.
its correct about sri aurobindo you have to be beyond human. The sex can be okay if you can handle it so it doesnt interfere your spiritual path, its true also about many tantric practisers they are so ignorant and they look old too actually later stages for some reason. So that point of view too much is bad
i dont think we should worry about emissions that much, ofcourse its important to control senses, but it can even come out while your peeing, little bit, so if body itself pushes very little out it doesnt affect you negatively, at very beginning only it seems like that.
Really, osho is fraud too ? where do you know information about it, or are there any proofs, i know yogi bhajan was also one who abuses peoples :O Thats crazy what their doing
“Really, osho is fraud too ?”
lt’s enough for me to believe osho is a fraud simply based on what he said about Sri Aurobindo [below quote]. Chinmoy and Sai Baba would be others. l tend to think sai baba had some kind of ‘vital or astral’ power, like mother meera in germany.
Osho quote:
‘Sri Aurobindo is a strange case. He knows everything about enlightenment, but he is not enlightened.
He is one of the greatest scholars of this age, a genius; vast is his knowledge. But his knowing is nil. He knows about the scriptures, and he knows better than anybody else.
His interpretation is profound, very logical, but heartless. It is dead; it is not coming out of his own realization.
This is one of the great problems for all seekers of truth: one can get lost in knowledge without knowing anything about the reality.
He knows all the theories, all the philosophies, but he is just a blind man who knows everything about light but has not seen the light himself. And it is possible to remain in a deception for your whole life — because you know so much, and people start worshipping you, people start believing you. And belief has its own psychology: if many people believe in you, you are bound to believe in yourself’.
But, even osho’s second in command criticised him in a book later –
‘And then there’s Osho — the reports of orgies and illicit drugs maybe add to the aura of his beliefs, but bung in millions of dollars, and major politics, not to mention other less favourable reports from his own former number 2. “Ma Anand Sheela”, who went on to write a book – and here’s an excerpt: “It shows him as an exploitative and manipulative guru who used the respect and goodwill he commanded to expand his fortune. Sheela describes how he carried on a long-standing sexual relationship with his attendant, Christine Woolf, a suicidal British national whom he renamed Vivek, and hints at his multiple sexual liaisons with other sanyasins. When Vivek became pregnant with Osho’s child, which Sheela claims Vivek planned on purpose to teach the guru a lesson, Osho got the pregnancy aborted and Vivek sterilised’
thank you, but i dont understand how sai baba was fraud. So far i read about him, he got angry easily and was mean. but nothing to do with fakeness
Well a lot of sai baba’s prophecy’s never happened, apparently. l believe he did have some astral [vital] powers, though.
Here’s a few quotes which l think are genuine:
“When Sathya Sai Baba died on 24 April 2011 at the age of 85 years, he proved once again that miracles and predictions fail. He had predicted at a public gathering at his head quarters in Puttaparthy, in 2000, and repeatedly many times, that he would die at the age of 96 only. And till the last moment, many of his devotees clung to his word and waited for a miracle. May it be an eye opener for the millions of gullible people whom he misguided and deluded”
“Sathya Sai Baba insisted in all seriousness that he was god, the creator of the universe, and “proved” his divinity with a couple of small “miracles”. As son of a village tantric he was familiar with the hand sleights and tricks of the trade. However, he did not only fascinate poor and uneducated villagers with his fraudulent performances. Over the years, he managed to attract a galaxy of India’s rich and powerful, among them ministers, prime ministers, presidents, chief justices, top industrialists and superstars”
But mostly, it was his claim that Sri Aurobindo was referring to him [sai baba] when Sri Krishna descended into Sri Aurobindo’s body on 24 November, 1926 –
“Being a consummate showman, Sai Baba never missed an opportunity for self-aggrandizement. He took great delight at playing an Avatar, appropriating their sacred symbols such as Kalki’s White Horse and Shesha, the Aeonic serpent which he had made into a bed. But his most outrageous stunt by far was deceitfully insinuating himself into one of the most important events in Indian spiritual history. On 24 November, 1926, after a lifetime of yoga, Sri Aurobindo and the Mother sent word to their sadhaks asking them to assemble in the upper verandah of the Library House in their Ashram in Pondicherry to hear about something of supreme importance that had happened in the history of the Earth and Universe. On what was later to become known as ‘Victory Day’ or the day of Siddhi, Sri Aurobindo announced that Krishna, the Overmental Godhead had descended into the physical, meaning Sri Aurobindo himself. As the Mother explained, ‘…Krishna consented to descend into Sri Aurobindo’s body – to be FIXED there. Then I saw him – I saw him with my own eyes (inner eyes, of course), join himself to Sri Aurobindo”
Upon learning of this momentous event many years later, Sai Baba changed the date of his birth from 4 October, 1929 to 23 November, 1926 and claimed that Sri Aurobindo was obviously referring to Baba who was supposedly born on the previous day (Nov. 23), and that he (Sri Aurobindo) had taken voluntary retirement after handing the reins over to the new God incarnate. [2] While his followers continue to insist that November, 23, 1926 was Baba’s true birthday, a horoscope cast for 4 October, 1929, the birth date on Baba’s original school records, removes all doubt by indicating his passing in 2011 when Pluto, the planet of death, moved by progression into a conjunction with his natal Sun”
This is together with all the sleight of hand and magic tricks, which have been adequately debunked imo. But, whether he had an actual siddhi or produced these so-called miracles through sleight of hand, as the watches suggest, is a moot question.
l think the following is probably true about him – lntermediate Zone [from Sr Aurobindo’s letter], that is.
“Anyone who has followed the career of Sai Baba cannot escape the conclusion that he is wholly a creature of the Intermediate Zone and has become an instrument of vital beings whose sole purpose is to usurp the higher truths of the Supramental age through a process of distortion, misrepresentation, and lies. It is additionally known by experienced occultists that one of the costs of maintaining one’s power on that vital plane is a huge increase in one’s sexual appetites. The heated controversy surrounding Sai Baba’s alleged pedophilia has been taken up elsewhere but it bears pointing out that when the United Nations, the British Parliament and the U.S. State Department all issue warnings of inappropriate sexual behavior involving youths and children by a prominent local religious leader at an ashram located in Andhra Pradesh”
thank you for enlighting about it, it was kind of shock to hear he was pedophile too :O..
actually if you watching hes face and also some other gurus you sense, that its something dirty in them and its better to avoid them. Do you feel that too ?
do you think he faked that yoga practise too where yogi cuts hes limb off and it grows back..
Its the only practise where i feel is it really possible in reality 😀 it just sounds too unbelievable.
“actually if you watching hes face and also some other gurus you sense, that its something dirty in them and its better to avoid them. Do you feel that too ?”
Yes, exactly. lf you look at Sri Aurobindo and The Mother, or Ramana, or Anandamayima there’s a Spirtual quality in their faces – no doubt for me. Sri Ramakrishna’s was full of Ananda – you can’t miss it.
“do you think he faked that yoga practise too where yogi cuts hes limb off and it grows back..
Its the only practise where i feel is it really possible in reality 😀 it just sounds too unbelievable”
l hadn’t heard of that one lol. But, l’m inclined to agree with you.
The only story l’ve heard which is similar was in Yogananda’s book ‘Autobiography of a Yogi’, where his teacher Sri Yuketeswar was out taking a stroll in the Himalaya’s, when a bandit came up and chopped yuketeswar’s arm off. Sri Yuketeswar, apparently, just stuck it back on – many miraculous events in that book.